My Community
SundayLeague => General Sundayleague Discussion => Topic started by: captain_kush on October 13, 2018, 12:35:05 PM
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Hi peeps,
Since I've come back to the game again (a couple of weeks ago) I have been doing much thinking and consideration. I first started playing this game around 2002ish if I remember correctly on the planetfootball server before the merge. Problems began to happen in the game and we managers were promised change. SL2 got released but was hardly a game changer and now after coming back, it's a real pity to see the same problems and nothing being done about it. If I'm honest, I think it is a disgrace. The reason I say this is just look at the amount of managers still actively playing....A lot of you have stuck to the game being as loyal as you can be waiting patiently for any positive changes. I quit the game dude to the broken promises and I believe many other managers have quit for the same reason.
I would like to purchase SL and make this game fantastic. I have always seen the potential of this game and I still believe that SL can be expanded globally and can be in a much better position than is currently in now. I would re tweak everything by re-coding the game, fixing the match engine, adding features that managers have been waiting for and most importantly, make SL as fun as as attractive as possible. I have messaged Junior via feedback and I am still waiting for a reply. This may be a problem as from what I've read on the forums, Junior hardly replies to anyone these days. For this, if there is anyone out there that knows how I can personally get in contact with Junior, please do let me know. He might read the forums from time to time, so if he does, I hope he reads this and gets back to me. I'm hoping that this post will be able to gain some valuable attraction/attention.
At the end of the day, I will do my utter best to try and purchase SL. However if this is a no go, I will end up creating a game from scratch but this will take considerably longer for me as the core of SL will not be available and I will have to be careful what to include as I'm not looking to get sued by anyone. Just a quick mention about myself; I am currently a data scientist (BSc in mathematics & MSc in applied statistics) working for 2 companies. My work ranges and I specialise in machine learning development, statistical modelling, data visualisations, and using programming languages (R, Python, SQL, etc). I have a fantastic team behind me and I am ready for this new challenge if given the chance. I want to make this game greater again and finally fix all the issues with SL. It's time for a change and its obvious to see that the owners don't care about the game no more, so they might aswell sell it to me :D
I don't want to get anyone's hopes up but I will try to speak to the owners and come to an agreement if they are willing to talk. I will update everyone once I know more.
I thank you for taking the time in reading this and any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks and best regards.
20/10/2018:
Created a poll. Please give your honest answer as all feedback is greatly appreciated.
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Good luck :)
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I wish you all the best Mustapha
How time flies, i think you'd just left uni when we last spoke ;D
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Hi Mustapha,
I'm sure this is welcome and encouraging news for all the loyal core of managers that have stuck with SL1. I've known you from way back, and great to see you not only returning, but bringing hope to us all that the game we love so much can be developed for all our continued enjoyment. I think I started playing back in 2003, wow 15 years and counting :)
If the present owners of SL1 have no intention of upgrading and developing the game ( which has been the case for many years ) then why not sell up and hand over the reigns to someone that does? No idea how much the purchase price would be. Even if they are unwilling to sell, maybe they could come to some sort of arrangement with you and your team that is to the benefit of the game and to us all ( Collaboration, give your team development rights ).
I wish you all the best in this, i really do, let's hope that someone out there is listening and paying attention!!!
Best regards
Deca
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Who exactly owns CatGames / SL these days? A quick look on Companies House shows that CatGames has been dissolved, so presumably there isn't such a company anymore. 7 of the 9 directors have resigned leaving two that are active, which are Cedric McMillian (I take it this is Junior?) and a Assem Alireza who resides in Saudi Arabia. Theoretically, would these be the two people you would need to "buy" off? Admittedly somebody more intelligent than me would need to confirm this as I haven't really got a clue regarding Companies House documents / accountancy etc!
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03912552/officers
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I wish you all the best Mustapha
How time flies, i think you'd just left uni when we last spoke ;D
Thanks a lot mate and to everyone else. Yes time is flying and I feel time flies even quicker as we grow older. Still remember the good old SL days like it was yesterday. See you soon in 2-1-1 ;)
Who exactly owns CatGames / SL these days? A quick look on Companies House shows that CatGames has been dissolved, so presumably there isn't such a company anymore. 7 of the 9 directors have resigned leaving two that are active, which are Cedric McMillian (I take it this is Junior?) and a Assem Alireza who resides in Saudi Arabia. Theoretically, would these be the two people you would need to "buy" off? Admittedly somebody more intelligent than me would need to confirm this as I haven't really got a clue regarding Companies House documents / accountancy etc!
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03912552/officers
Thanks for this! Will look into this and investigate.
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Hi Mustapha,
I'm sure this is welcome and encouraging news for all the loyal core of managers that have stuck with SL1. I've known you from way back, and great to see you not only returning, but bringing hope to us all that the game we love so much can be developed for all our continued enjoyment. I think I started playing back in 2003, wow 15 years and counting :)
If the present owners of SL1 have no intention of upgrading and developing the game ( which has been the case for many years ) then why not sell up and hand over the reigns to someone that does? No idea how much the purchase price would be. Even if they are unwilling to sell, maybe they could come to some sort of arrangement with you and your team that is to the benefit of the game and to us all ( Collaboration, give your team development rights ).
I wish you all the best in this, i really do, let's hope that someone out there is listening and paying attention!!!
Best regards
Deca
Thanks Deca, we will see how it goes.
Will keep you all posted.
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Who exactly owns CatGames / SL these days? A quick look on Companies House shows that CatGames has been dissolved, so presumably there isn't such a company anymore. 7 of the 9 directors have resigned leaving two that are active, which are Cedric McMillian (I take it this is Junior?) and a Assem Alireza who resides in Saudi Arabia. Theoretically, would these be the two people you would need to "buy" off? Admittedly somebody more intelligent than me would need to confirm this as I haven't really got a clue regarding Companies House documents / accountancy etc!
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03912552/officers
I managed to find Cedric McMillian Junior on linkedin, sent him a message and requested to connect. His profile states that he left his role as ''development director'' back in March 2012 and ''Designed and Developed Sundaylegaue.com which has had over 6million players since it's creation''. lol
He is now working for a company called Box Legal as a web developer.
Will do more research and hopefully he gets back to me on linkedin.
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I think Jimbo has him on Facebook, so you could always go through him. As Junior appears to be employed elsewhere I gather he runs SL on the side. Decent little earner to be fair if he gets a cut from the credit sales through PayPal.
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I sent Junior a text yesterday in regards to this and a 3am Cup bug over on SL2. As of yet I've not had a reply but hopefully he will visit this forum a take a look for himself when he can. Fingers crossed :)
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I sent Junior a text yesterday in regards to this and a 3am Cup bug over on SL2. As of yet I've not had a reply but hopefully he will visit this forum a take a look for himself when he can. Fingers crossed :)
Thanks Ty, much appreciated!
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I got this from Junior some time ago.
Hi David,
Thanks for getting in touch.
I'm currently just maintaining things and hoping to meet with the other directors to see if they want to close down Cat Games and hand over the games to me
so I can put together some plans to try and improve things. It's a bit complicated, as I wasn't officially working for Cat Games for 5 years, but since Terry passed away
it came to our knowledge that there has been a large burden of debt that I'm trying to sort out with the other directors. I'll take on the debt, but would need them to let me have the games so I can get them developed.
We are hopefully meeting up soon to discuss this and if it goes well, I can make more concrete plans going forward.
Keep in touch and I'll let you know how it goes.
Kind Regards,
Junior
Maybe there are some non-disclosure considerations involved which is why he has gone dark?
I think I also used his name and an assortment of websites to track down his "proper" workplace and then an address for him which I was even able to identify on Google Earth. I can't remember it and can't find a record but if you don't have his full details, it shows it can be done.
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I got this from Junior some time ago.
Hi David,
Thanks for getting in touch.
I'm currently just maintaining things and hoping to meet with the other directors to see if they want to close down Cat Games and hand over the games to me
so I can put together some plans to try and improve things. It's a bit complicated, as I wasn't officially working for Cat Games for 5 years, but since Terry passed away
it came to our knowledge that there has been a large burden of debt that I'm trying to sort out with the other directors. I'll take on the debt, but would need them to let me have the games so I can get them developed.
We are hopefully meeting up soon to discuss this and if it goes well, I can make more concrete plans going forward.
Keep in touch and I'll let you know how it goes.
Kind Regards,
Junior
Maybe there are some non-disclosure considerations involved which is why he has gone dark?
I think I also used his name and an assortment of websites to track down his "proper" workplace and then an address for him which I was even able to identify on Google Earth. I can't remember it and can't find a record but if you don't have his full details, it shows it can be done.
Thanks for this..... Very interesting.
I still have not heard anything back from Junior (through feedback and a message/connect request on Linkedin)
Ty kindly messaged him personally on my behalf but nothing through there yet.
I wonder who these other directors are? Tried to go on the actual Cat Games website (www.catgames.com) but no information is shown there. Furthermore, I tried the 'contact us' in which I filled everything out but not surprisingly an error when trying to send.
I have only heard of Terry's passing since I've come back to the game. Terry was a great man and may he rest in peace. I just find it difficult to understand that since Terry's passing (Jan 2016 I believe?? not sure) No meetings have been arranged with the directors. I understand Junior wasn't part of Cat Games then but I believe he has some sort of stake/partnership in this game we play and surely he should make a better effort in trying to resolve all of this. This is really weird to understand because I was told that Junior bailed out the game some months back and made a lot of promises at the beginning of the year in regards to improving the game but now he just ignores admins and feedbacks. Just doesn't make sense to me that he bailed SL and wants to improve the game but yet at the same time ''run away from SL''. It is a strange one.... Maybe I'm wrong? If someone could shed some light on this, would be awesome to know more information.
I am still very interested in buying SL, and gladly will take on the debt and develop the game given that the debt and purchase of SL is within my capability. If Junior is also interested in this as so he claims, I would be down to make some sort of partnership but all I require is to speak to him or the directors in order to come up with a plan if possible.
I will keep trying to dig holes and see where this takes me. Any support from current managers would be greatly appreciated in order to create some noise. Hopefully Junior reads this thread and gets back to me.
All information regarding this is welcomes... the more I know, the better.
I thank everyone once again for all help and support.
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All credit to you and the best of luck Mustapha,
If anyone can help with contact with Junior, or knows how to get in touch with him then please help,
It's in all of our interests that this game gets developed, and we should all try to help as much as we can
Regards
Deca
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I'd take another look at the CatGames information on Companies House Kush, there only appears to be two directors as I've mentioned above. Link again is as follows:
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03912552/filing-history
I've had a quick nose around and under the "Total exemption small company accounts" under the filling history tab there's a PDF which goes into more financial detail around the year of 2016. If I've worked this out correctly there seemed to be £5,353 in assets but £11,597 in liabilities leaving a figure of -£6,244. There appeared to be other long term liabilities too so what Junior said about the debt was correct.
In all fairness to Junior he's always managed to reply and despite the lack of game improvements he has kept it running for a long amount of time. Whether that's for financial gain, the love of SL or keeping it going in respect to the late Terry Ricketts who knows. I know I've only been back 5mins but If he were to relenquish control of SL I'd hope Kush or whoever shows the same reliability and can keep it running for the SL diehards who've been playing for years, with significant ME improvements too! ;)
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I'd take another look at the CatGames information on Companies House Kush, there only appears to be two directors as I've mentioned above. Link again is as follows:
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03912552/filing-history
I've had a quick nose around and under the "Total exemption small company accounts" under the filling history tab there's a PDF which goes into more financial detail around the year of 2016. If I've worked this out correctly there seemed to be £5,353 in assets but £11,597 in liabilities leaving a figure of -£6,244. There appeared to be other long term liabilities too so what Junior said about the debt was correct.
In all fairness to Junior he's always managed to reply and despite the lack of game improvements he has kept it running for a long amount of time. Whether that's for financial gain, the love of SL or keeping it going in respect to the late Terry Ricketts who knows. I know I've only been back 5mins but If he were to relenquish control of SL I'd hope Kush or whoever shows the same reliability and can keep it running for the SL diehards who've been playing for years, with significant ME improvements too! ;)
Thanks dude much appreciated.
Just had a quick skim through.... So the only directors left are Junior and Asseum as Sally left her post.
Very interesting to see the amount of shareholders.
Cat Games officially dissolved at the beginning of the year which means that Cat Games have officially closed their business. SL is still up and running though.... Does this mean the business now running illegally/fraudulently? If the company has dissolved and people can still buy credits, who is taking this money? Is dissolving a company a tactic in order to clear debts? Don't really know much when it comes to these things but I will have discussions with someone I know who does.
Will need to look into this properly in full detail which I will do so during the weekend.
Who exactly owns CatGames / SL these days? A quick look on Companies House shows that CatGames has been dissolved, so presumably there isn't such a company anymore. 7 of the 9 directors have resigned leaving two that are active, which are Cedric McMillian (I take it this is Junior?) and a Assem Alireza who resides in Saudi Arabia. Theoretically, would these be the two people you would need to "buy" off? Admittedly somebody more intelligent than me would need to confirm this as I haven't really got a clue regarding Companies House documents / accountancy etc!
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03912552/officers
You are right though Gull, I will have to speak to Junior or Assem. If anyone here knows more information regarding this, I would really appreciate it if you could explain this.
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Sundayleague is now run by a company called CMGamers.
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Sundayleague is now run by a company called CMGamers.
Hi Steven,
Were did you get this information from if you don't mind me asking?
Do they have a website? I've tried to google them but couldn't find anything. I'm leaving work now so when I get back home, I will research
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I believe at the beginning at the year or late last year, Junior put a message on latest news saying he had sole control but had to rename company. As and when you buy credits you will see that the merchant is CMGamers.
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That ties in with the CatGames being dissolved on the 2nd January 2018. There certainly won't be any Companies House information about "CMGamer" until a year of trading
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I believe at the beginning at the year or late last year, Junior put a message on latest news saying he had sole control but had to rename company. As and when you buy credits you will see that the merchant is CMGamers.
Ok cool, so that means Junior has 100% stake and control. He's the man I need to get in contact with! I have found some personal details online which I will not post here and try to get in contact
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That ties in with the CatGames being dissolved on the 2nd January 2018. There certainly won't be any Companies House information about "CMGamer" until a year of trading
Yes, starting to make a bit of sense now. Slowly getting there.
Whether my idea succeeds or fails, atleast I can say to myself that I tried.
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Kush the effort alone your putting in now shows what you could do for the game mate! Hope everything works out!
Tony
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Just want to concur with what Tony said. This game could be huge again it once was. So much has changed in terms of internet gaming since sundayleague fell back to one server. Im sure it would work out much better if relaunched again, there is no other game like this out there.
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Another thing I forgot to mention was whether SL going forward could benefit from some kind of member ownership of the game.
The brief video below succinctly explains how football trusts work in the professional game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-2lPxgtC60
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I have fantastic news. I have been in touch with Junior and will be holding further talks.
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Brilliant news, that has made my day :) :)
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Brilliant news, that has made my day :) :)
Thanks Deca and me to!
Junior is interested in selling in order to move this game forward. Currently in the process of trying to set up a call/meeting for further serious talks.
Will keep everyone updated.
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Just created a poll on this thread so would appreciate it a lot if you could all vote.
Thanks.
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I haven't voted (yet) because the only option I might vote for would be the first one and "improvement" could only, by definition, be a good thing. And I know this isn't a democratic process.
But "improvements" is a bit too vague? SL2 was supposed to be an improvement on SL1 and, for some, maybe it was but for me (and others?) it certainly wasn't. So I'm very definitely not anti new ownership, because I doubt we can go on the way we're going for much longer and it wouldn't be my money being invested (well very little of it would be and not immediately) but it would be a shame if it (and undiscussed "improvements" and "new features") caused me (and some others?) to eventually (and sadly) have to find something grown-up and useful to do with the time we currently spend on SL :D
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I have voted " other".
I'd be very happy to see new management but the phrase "new features" worries me much like Davef said above.
I think the game needs maintaining in its current form without too much change. Things that aren't working should be fixed and there are things that could be done to make playing the game more convenient but I wouldn't like to see they type of add ons that were brought in for SL2.
The main thing I'd like to see change is the number of people playing the game. I'd like to see all the leagues filled at all levels so that it becomes a real challenge to get towards the top of the pyramid. So, the key skills for the new management in my opinion should be marketing rather than software development. In the old days when there were thousands of managers playing there were links to Sunday League on the front pages of the main websites of lots of major football clubs. I myself joined the game in 2003 after clicking a link on manunited.com. I realise that premier league football clubs these days have moved on and now earn vast sums from advertising on their websites so that a link on a premier league website may be unfeasible but there will be smaller clubs and other ways to attract people to the game. To my mind, invest in marketing , do it well and efficiently making best use of the funds available and then use the cash that comes in from the new people playing the game to employ staff to maintain the game properly.
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Same as above. I don't want want anything too different to how it currently is. The grass isn't always greener, and the current version satisfies my competitive urge quite thoroughly. There needs to be a few extra players on the transfer market, the match engine can be a bit temperamental at times, and it would be lovely if there could be some kind of improvement to leagues (i.e., having group stages before knock-out stages) and improvements to prizes. Little things. But too many features will create confusion and annoyance (see SL2).
But I've said it before and I'll say it again, there needs to be a clear INSTRUCTION MANUAL for new players who join and don't know what they're doing. How can we expect people to stick around if they don't know which boots are best for certain conditions, which tactics are advantantateous, how to set up a team (and that they have to BUY CREDITS WITH ACTUAL MONEY to set up this team), as well as everything else about SL that we know and love. This is what SL has always lacked... an instruction manual that is flash bang in front of them as soon as they sign up, and an incentive to get them to stay upon joining. And the rest comes down to solid marketing... social media, paid adverts, screenshots of the game put about - the full works.
I'm happy to throw about some more ideas. I work for a technological firm and have been involved in the research/insight and marketing side of things for almost 4 years. (And have been a SL player since 2000... on and off). More than happy to help.
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Being a Football Manager fan, my biggest request would be an improvement to the tactical side of the game. I think it's just too easy to stick with a 4-5-1 beats all formation for forever more. Perhaps a squad depth of 22 players would allow enough cover for different formations. I hate the idea of 4-4-2 being so ineffective in this game, it should be the complete opposite.
Tend to agree with all the above posters. The difference in SL1 & SL2 is night & day, with the latter a disaster in my opinion.
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The reason we all love SL1, and those that leave SL1 keep returning is because of it's simple game play and ease of use.
It needs bringing up to date, and new features added, but keeping the format more or less the same, and avoiding the disaster that became SL2
The game can be globally expanded to Europe and the continent, so that we have true European & World competitions.
All this will take time, but fixing things, bringing up to date, releasing frequent updates and introducing new features gradually ( not all at once ) will improve the game no end
Just takes a bit of vision, patience, and buy in from us all
Cheers
Deca
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Thanks for this guys and I completely understand where everyone is coming from.
If given the chance to take over, I would take all values into account. I don't want to add SL2 features at all to SL1. I would want to keep the game similar to how it is now but would like to fix the tactical side of the game which includes formations, players and the match engine. Moreover, the whole game will have to be re coded and built with the latest technology. The main aspect will be improvement (maintenance as 3 eyed raven said) on the game that is currently available. New features may include a bigger team as Gull suggested, a different way of entering the transfer market with more variety. Adding more official competitions etc and eventually creating a mobile app. If the time comes, I would ask help from everybody playing the game and all suggestions would be very welcome.
the absolute first thing would be maintenance and once that is cleared up, advertising. I just want all you to remember that I'm just like you guys. I know how this game is and I have been playing on and off for a very long time. All this game needs is to be more powerful which can be done with a few tweaks and then getting this game out in the market to attract as many players as possible. I am not going to do anything to jeopardise what we have already. I am here to make this game fun and valuable again and most importantly make it try to gain attention. I have already thought of the marketing sides and have some plans already set. As an example; I personally know a few people on Instagram who have 6 digit followers. I have spoken to them before regarding advertisement (before and not on SL) and they are willing to give me a lending hand. That alone could bring a lot of new players in.
The whole reason of this poll created was just to see a rough idea on the opinions of players currently still playing.
I will create a list of what I think needs improvement in this game and what new features could be added.
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Just a quick list:
Maintenance issues:
Manager profile: Make it look more appealing
Team history: Fixing this page so that everyone is able to see your history and accomplishments. Some team history pages for certain managers are messed up and you are not able to see the furthest column on the right side properly.
Fixing the match engine
Improvement on formations in regards to the match engine (not just 4-5-1, 5-2-3, 2-5-3 that are used to have an advantage)
Allowing you to rank numerous players in terms of captaincy, pens, free kicks, corners (fix the goalkeeper taking issue)
Fixing the subs glitch (a team shouldnt have to make their subs early in the game)
add more players to the transfer market
Fix the game in progress glitch
Examples of features:
Past League positions on history page: You are able to highlight a particular season and when clicked, able to see the final table standings and history regarding that season.
Possibility of buying players from other managers and not just from the transfer market
adding new competitions to the game: TCL and europa will become an official compeition etc. Winner of champs shield vs winner of elite cup and more
tutorial guide for new players signing up so they understand the game from the get go and resume playing.
Expanding the number of players allowed in your team from 20 to ....
New generation of squad players where one can play in more than one position DEF(RC)
I just literally created this now quickly as an example so please don't take the features seriously. I know I've missed out on other things but I just wanted to give an example of how I would go around SL. I would need views and suggestions from absolute everyone playing so a questionnaire will have to made for everyone to answer along with player meetings.
I am not here to mess this game up and change it in any different ways. To be honest I am doing this for the community of SL as you all deserve better than this. There is no way I am following the SL2 route as that was a major FLOP in my opinion. I'm only interested in fixing SL1 ... I wouldn't even know what to do with SL2.
I want to improve SL1 based on what the community wants.
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Perhaps I may have confused some of you by what I mean by 'improvement'.
The first thing that needs to be done is maintenance. Fixing all current issues/bugs/glitches. This will need to be done as soon as possible so I potentially would need a list of what problems there currently is. I have an idea of some already but I've only been back now for a few weeks since quitting around 5 years ago.
After maintenance is done, the next thing would be is how to improve SL on cetain aspects such inplay, navigation, visibility, optimization, cleaning (i.e recoding), performance etc.
After this we go into the marketing and advertising side of the game and how we can get SL noticed.
The points mentioned above is what I mean by 'improvement' when all added up together
We then think of adding features based on what the community want as a whole. Also look into building a mobile app for SL as everyone has a smartphone these days.
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I honestly think that the game needs small changes, like Kush has mentioned. The actual structure of the game is good, it just needs tweaks to certain glitches that have been discovered due to years of the game not being updated.
One game-changer would be a mobile app for SL1. If we're talking about the easiest way of attracting new customers to the website, then an app is the way to go. I know that's different development but if we want to drive new people to the site then an app and intelligent SEO, PPC or targeted affiliate marketing is what's going to bring people here.
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I am not here to mess this game up and change it in any different ways. To be honest I am doing this for the community of SL as you all deserve better than this. There is no way I am following the SL2 route as that was a major FLOP in my opinion. I'm only interested in fixing SL1 ... I wouldn't even know what to do with SL2.
I want to improve SL1 based on what the community wants.
I'd be very offended if SL2 wasn't given the attention of SL1 in the future. For me SL2 was a vast improvement when it was introduced in 2011. It was vibrant and very playable if you took time to learn how to play. On introduction it was vastly populated and the forums and chat were as busy as the old version if not more so. Terry did a great job in my opinion. And I believe it's a much more polished version of Sundayleague. The only downfall has been the lack of maintenance and advertising much the same as the old game.
If customers who persevered with its growth and development are going to be ignored with a change in ownership I for one won't go back to playing this version because I feel it's a massive step backwards and would be a kick in the teeth to the effort Terry made to develop a game that for me and some others is much better.
I've played SL since its inception and chose to join the new platform because I felt this game had stagnated and become too dated. I don't blame others who didn't like the change, everyone has different tastes. But I think if there can't be two versions of this site that just need to be advertised and developed then those who want something different are being ignored as customers.
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I am not here to mess this game up and change it in any different ways. To be honest I am doing this for the community of SL as you all deserve better than this. There is no way I am following the SL2 route as that was a major FLOP in my opinion. I'm only interested in fixing SL1 ... I wouldn't even know what to do with SL2.
I want to improve SL1 based on what the community wants.
I'd be very offended if SL2 wasn't given the attention of SL1 in the future. For me SL2 was a vast improvement when it was introduced in 2011. It was vibrant and very playable if you took time to learn how to play. On introduction it was vastly populated and the forums and chat were as busy as the old version if not more so. Terry did a great job in my opinion. And I believe it's a much more polished version of Sundayleague. The only downfall has been the lack of maintenance and advertising much the same as the old game.
If customers who persevered with its growth and development are going to be ignored with a change in ownership I for one won't go back to playing this version because I feel it's a massive step backwards and would be a kick in the teeth to the effort Terry made to develop a game that for me and some others is much better.
I've played SL since its inception and chose to join the new platform because I felt this game had stagnated and become too dated. I don't blame others who didn't like the change, everyone has different tastes. But I think if there can't be two versions of this site that just need to be advertised and developed then those who want something different are being ignored as customers.
Completely understand this. The issue is (I guess nobody but Junior really knows the answer) is to how profitable/sustainable both forms of SL are. I haven't ever played SL2 so can't comment but if one format of the game is busier and generates more revenue, then naturally that game will get focused on.
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I guess the proof's in the pudding. In terms of active users SL2 looks pretty much dead. How many users have tried SL2 and gone back to SL1 or left altogether when it was first rolled out? Has to be a high amount. It looks like Munkeespuzz has admirably "persevered with it's growth" but unfortunately for SL2, at this current point, very few others have.
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I guess the proof's in the pudding. In terms of active users SL2 looks pretty much dead. How many users have tried SL2 and gone back to SL1 or left altogether when it was first rolled out? Has to be a high amount. It looks like Munkeespuzz has admirably "persevered with it's growth" but unfortunately for SL2, at this current point, very few others have.
SL2 --- Been there, did it, hated it, stopped doing it.
As for finances, I reckon, from what I remember, SL2 could probably improve player-numbers by lowering the cost to managers? Which might help in one way but be counter-productive in another.
SL1 could (probably?) manage a smallish price increase in credits and (maybe?) on the entry fees for PLs (but not, IMO, on transfer fees, at least at the lowest price). Some decent marketing might bring in merchandise which could then be given for winning anything where there is a credits prize now (maybe give an option for taking credits instead on wins by teams not in X X-1-1s?).
And nothing to stop regular big entry fee, 8 team, big prizes PLs for big teams, big egos, big wallets and big ambitions if on a good run of form? ;-)
I'd suggest all managers in the top 64 could sell a relatives organ and donate the income to SL --- but I suspect some cultures frown on that kind of thing so maybe it would need discussing properly?
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Once I have a full discussion/meeting with Junior, I will be able to know more about SL1 and SL2 regarding finances. Everything will be evaluated then. I have a feeling this is going to take a long procedure.
I have not heard back from Junior since last Friday which is a bit worrying but he did mention he is busy with his time being very limited.
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Once I have a full discussion/meeting with Junior, I will be able to know more about SL1 and SL2 regarding finances. Everything will be evaluated then. I have a feeling this is going to take a long procedure.
I have not heard back from Junior since last Friday which is a bit worrying but he did mention he is busy with his time being very limited.
Thank you for all of the updates Kush. This particular forum post reminded me of a similar scenario I was once faced with when I used to play SL2. I left SL2 for various reasons, however, to cut a long story short I was liaising with Sally & Junior with the intention to meet to discuss SL2's problems and the possible solutions. I set an agenda but unfortunately the meeting never happened...
I am happy to share my agenda (please see attached) which I shared with Junior & Sally on 27/05/16.
If you do get the opportunity to meet with Junior it would be great for you to share what gets discussed as it would be brilliant to see some of the ideas mentioned in this forum thread to be embedded. Since I have moved over to SL1 I personally prefer this version and genuinely enjoy the game.
Many thanks
Jimbo 8)
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Once I have a full discussion/meeting with Junior, I will be able to know more about SL1 and SL2 regarding finances. Everything will be evaluated then. I have a feeling this is going to take a long procedure.
I have not heard back from Junior since last Friday which is a bit worrying but he did mention he is busy with his time being very limited.
Thank you for all of the updates Kush. This particular forum post reminded me of a similar scenario I was once faced with when I used to play SL2. I left SL2 for various reasons, however, to cut a long story short I was liaising with Sally & Junior with the intention to meet to discuss SL2's problems and the possible solutions. I set an agenda but unfortunately the meeting never happened...
I am happy to share my agenda (please see attached) which I shared with Junior & Sally on 27/05/16.
If you do get the opportunity to meet with Junior it would be great for you to share what gets discussed as it would be brilliant to see some of the ideas mentioned in this forum thread to be embedded. Since I have moved over to SL1 I personally prefer this version and genuinely enjoy the game.
Many thanks
Jimbo 8)
Thanks for this Jimbo - Really helpful. It's a shame you was never able to meet up and discuss. For me the communities feedback as so important and it's a must if we are to bring this game forward.
Yes I remember when SL2 was released. I signed up and was not a fan at all especially with all the extra perks... It felt like you would have to buy a lot of credits just to compete. Never gave it a chance and still stuck with SL1 in which I did prefer.
Ofcourse If I was to meet up with Junior and continue talks, I would mention everything we have discussed. I will always interact with the community and share everything. I am still waiting for another reply from Junior. Will wait up until tomorrow and if nothing, will be pushy and send more messages. I don't want to be persistent as I respect Junior's time but will have no other alternative in order to chase further talks if communication is taking longer than expected.
Moreover, when a meeting has been scheduled. I am more than happy for any current players to come and attend this meeting given that it isn't everyone. My office space is limited lol. I live in London and my office is located next to Aldgate East station. If a meeting is not possible, can always have a conference call on Skype :)
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Wow! Just learned about this and exciting news perhaps. Just wanted to say I first registered on Charlie until the merge and have played SL1 regularly since. I, like many others, did help beta test SL2 but found it far too time consuming and complicated so that didn't last long for me and I've never looked back.
I would say not everyone uses a smartphone/mobile - I still use my pc to play games, including SL. I agree the ME needs fixing with regards to the crazy 3 formations a lot continually use which took away the skill factor. The friendly league which I know not everyone is a fan of but I've always taken seriously needs some fixes so *everyone* gets a chance to fill up their schedules *before* games are refunded (!) but otherwise I really like how this is going so far and other improvements/fixes suggested.
Good luck with it Kush. I wish you well and look forward to hearing more as time goes on. :
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I am not here to mess this game up and change it in any different ways. To be honest I am doing this for the community of SL as you all deserve better than this. There is no way I am following the SL2 route as that was a major FLOP in my opinion. I'm only interested in fixing SL1 ... I wouldn't even know what to do with SL2.
I want to improve SL1 based on what the community wants.
I'd be very offended if SL2 wasn't given the attention of SL1 in the future. For me SL2 was a vast improvement when it was introduced in 2011. It was vibrant and very playable if you took time to learn how to play. On introduction it was vastly populated and the forums and chat were as busy as the old version if not more so. Terry did a great job in my opinion. And I believe it's a much more polished version of Sundayleague. The only downfall has been the lack of maintenance and advertising much the same as the old game.
If customers who persevered with its growth and development are going to be ignored with a change in ownership I for one won't go back to playing this version because I feel it's a massive step backwards and would be a kick in the teeth to the effort Terry made to develop a game that for me and some others is much better.
I've played SL since its inception and chose to join the new platform because I felt this game had stagnated and become too dated. I don't blame others who didn't like the change, everyone has different tastes. But I think if there can't be two versions of this site that just need to be advertised and developed then those who want something different are being ignored as customers.
I don't think customers have been ignored. When SL2 first appeared, SL1 was in big decline and a lot of people tried SL2 and then rejected init favour of SL1. With respect, just because a few prefer SL2 doesn't necessarily make it "better" and, in a retail environment, it actually loses out.
If (and it seems an obvious gimmee) the continuation of SL1 and/or 2 will depend (as with pretty well every product put out to sale) on customer choice and much as SL2 has some fans, they would appear to be far far few in number than SL1 with numbers going down not up.
Perhaps those loving SL2 could wait 'til Kush's dealing have come to wonderful fruition then invest their money in buying the rights for SL2 from him? That's not meant to be harsh or nasty in any way but, given the apparent numbers, it might be the only way of saving SL2?
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I don't think customers have been ignored. When SL2 first appeared, SL1 was in big decline and a lot of people tried SL2 and then rejected init favour of SL1. With respect, just because a few prefer SL2 doesn't necessarily make it "better" and, in a retail environment, it actually loses out.
If (and it seems an obvious gimmee) the continuation of SL1 and/or 2 will depend (as with pretty well every product put out to sale) on customer choice and much as SL2 has some fans, they would appear to be far far few in number than SL1 with numbers going down not up.
Perhaps those loving SL2 could wait 'til Kush's dealing have come to wonderful fruition then invest their money in buying the rights for SL2 from him? That's not meant to be harsh or nasty in any way but, given the apparent numbers, it might be the only way of saving SL2?
I don't actually get what you are trying to say here? SL2 was never advertised on its release and just put in place as a upgrade for SL1 users. As it stood on its release, many users loved it as a new version of Sundayleague. And some were attracted who had never played the old game. It's only been let down by junior not advertising it and maintaining it as a stand alone site. I understand you might not like it as a game, but many do. And those of us that continue to pay for a product just as you do for the old site expect to have customer service too. Don't forget pitstopboss! People were still paying to play that game and catgames shut it down with no notice! If that happens again I'm sure you guys would be bleating! We are all customers with opinion and preferences.
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I don't think customers have been ignored. When SL2 first appeared, SL1 was in big decline and a lot of people tried SL2 and then rejected init favour of SL1. With respect, just because a few prefer SL2 doesn't necessarily make it "better" and, in a retail environment, it actually loses out.
If (and it seems an obvious gimmee) the continuation of SL1 and/or 2 will depend (as with pretty well every product put out to sale) on customer choice and much as SL2 has some fans, they would appear to be far far few in number than SL1 with numbers going down not up.
Perhaps those loving SL2 could wait 'til Kush's dealing have come to wonderful fruition then invest their money in buying the rights for SL2 from him? That's not meant to be harsh or nasty in any way but, given the apparent numbers, it might be the only way of saving SL2?
I don't actually get what you are trying to say here? SL2 was never advertised on its release and just put in place as a upgrade for SL1 users. As it stood on its release, many users loved it as a new version of Sundayleague. And some were attracted who had never played the old game. It's only been let down by junior not advertising it and maintaining it as a stand alone site. I understand you might not like it as a game, but many do. And those of us that continue to pay for a product just as you do for the old site expect to have customer service too. Don't forget pitstopboss! People were still paying to play that game and catgames shut it down with no notice! If that happens again I'm sure you guys would be bleating! We are all customers with opinion and preferences.
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I'm not trying to suggest SL2 should be ditched (the opposite would be true) but I do disagree about SL not being given a fair go. OK, it was only pushed (as far as we know) among existing SL1 managers and I think most had a look, some rejected it immediately, some stayed longer and some are still there playing the game (with or without playing SL1 as well). And I'm going to guess there are managers on SL2 who have never played SL1? If that is true then somehow the word got out about it because it has attracted those new customers?
My point was that if Kush (or anyone else) does take over the whole thing and intends to spend enough to ensure survival and invest for the future, financial pragmatism might involve ditching the least popular of the two versions or look to sell it. And I am only assuming SL1 is currently the more popular (and potentially more profitable) of the two. I'm not sure what you expect though? Should we all stand together and demand both games be kept going (involving extra investment) risking him not bothering with a purchase or just allow Kush to make a decision based on financial and market forces and take it however it goes? I doubt, though, that he'd just shut one down (if it became necessary) without warning or a serious dialogue with customers.
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i really hope that talks between Mustapha ( Kush ) and junior prove to be productive and the game can be taken forward and developed.
I don't think anyone is intentionally criticising SL2, I'm sure there were lots of managers that took the time to make the change from SL1, and got hooked liked the majority of us did on SL1. It's unfair for anyone to judge a game unless they have played it over a long period of time. It was a personal choice when SL2 was released, there were those that left SL1 and were happy to make the transition to SL2, those that remained with SL1 and didn't want to or have the time to invest in playing a game that was quite different to SL1 , those that were playing both at the same time, and over time those that returned to SL1 preferring the old format to the new.
One of the best features about SL1 is it's simplicity, so easy to play, and takes little time and effort to manage a team each day. Ideal for setting up tactics the night before or early morning before going to work, and a few minutes required in the evening to check results, change between rest & re-hab, and set up for the next day. Better suited for those of us that don't have lot's of time on our hands to invest, but still gain lot's of satisfaction from the game.
So this is my own USP ( Ultimate Selling Point in Marketing terms ) for SL1
So I can only speak for SL1 as that is the game I personally preferred to continue playing when SL2 was released, and the game I've played since registering back in March 2004 on the Team Talk server.
No doubt a business / development / marketing / advertising strategy & plan will be produced for the short / medium, and long term goals for the game.
Short term possibly 3-6 months, medium term 6 months to 2 years, and long term from 2 years onward.
We will all have our own ideas of what we would like to see in terms of development over time, and would all contribute to providing ideas and a wish list for future features to the game. So i will start the ball rolling, maybe a separate thread will be introduced on the forum for us all to contribute to the wish list.
Short Term
- Establish the future of the game ( business plan / strategy, talks between Mustapha & Junior, members wish list ). Answer the questions, where do we
want to take the game? how do we get there? how do we attract new players / members? what countries would we like to expand to in the long term?
what is the best way to advertise and market the game in the UK and in other countries?
- Bring the game up to date by fixing any bugs and re-coding so that is in a format and ready for future development
- Communication, provide regular feedback to the community via the forum / in the game of how development is progressing and what the intentions are
for the games future. Ensure feedback is answered promptly.
- Create a help / support / tutorial section for new players, as well as existing players.
Medium Term to Long
- Introduce game development updates on a regular basis incorporating the best features of the wish list from the forum. A few examples are;
True league pyramid system. One top tier ( Premier League of 16 teams ) above the 8 Conference top divisions. the top 2 in each Conference X-1-1
would play the bottom 8 teams in the premier league over two legs to either try to gain promotion to the premier league or fight to remain in the
premier league. ( Just my own idea ) Would need some thought though regarding Inter-Conference qualification, Champions Shield, and Elite Cup.
Incorporate the Friendly Leagues as part of the game. Incorporate UCB ( Ultimate Conference Battle ) as a feature of the game.
Incorporate the official ranking system as part of the game
Enable selling, as well as buying players on the transfer market, player auctions, etc. Obviously update the existing transfer market.
Introduce bigger squads, youth players / squads
Give players on the transfer markets and in squads real values so i.e. a player costing 10,000 credits would be £10,000,000. ! credit = £1000
Introduce a player star systems so that the best players can be recognised as super stars, super talents, etc.
Develop an in game feature so you can watch the highlights of your match rather than knowing the result straight away ( adds a bit of excitement ).
Anyone who has ever played "Rocking Soccer" would know the kind of match simulation that could be produced of the actual match.
Introduce facilities such as a stadium that can be developed so that virtual income can be generated from fans attendance
Gradually introduce the game to other countries, the ultimate goal to establish markets in Europe and the continent so that i.e. a proper champions
league can be introduced over time
Introduce national teams so that a player can manage a national team and pick from the creme de la creme of players from different countries, proper
tournaments such as the European, World cup etc.
I've played and I am playing quite a few footy management games, so just a few suggestions that might or might not be possible if the game is to be developed and moved on over time
Cheers
Deca
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One of the best features about SL1 is it's simplicity, so easy to play, and takes little time and effort to manage a team each day. Ideal for setting up tactics the night before or early morning before going to work, and a few minutes required in the evening to check results, change between rest & re-hab, and set up for the next day. Better suited for those of us that don't have lot's of time on our hands to invest, but still gain lot's of satisfaction from the game.
Personal opinion again but although I love SL I don't (after 20? odd years of playing) have the time (or desire) anymore to deeply analyze it all. If I have that kind of time I'd rather play Chess, cook a nice meal, do a Cryptic crossword --- or just sleep. Or talk to the wife. Or dog. :D
I don't see the games necessarily being mutually exclusive but they are different and, if finances are limited, it could surely conceivably come down to a choice between the two? I know others on SL1 have suggested in the past that they would invest in taking over the SL1 version of the game but has anyone on SL2 checked to see if any individual (or group) would be be willing to take that version forward separately? Just a thought.
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One of the best features about SL1 is it's simplicity, so easy to play, and takes little time and effort to manage a team each day. Ideal for setting up tactics the night before or early morning before going to work, and a few minutes required in the evening to check results, change between rest & re-hab, and set up for the next day. Better suited for those of us that don't have lot's of time on our hands to invest, but still gain lot's of satisfaction from the game.
Personal opinion again but although I love SL I don't (after 20? odd years of playing) have the time (or desire) anymore to deeply analyze it all. If I have that kind of time I'd rather play Chess, cook a nice meal, do a Cryptic crossword --- or just sleep. Or talk to the wife. Or dog. :D
I don't see the games necessarily being mutually exclusive but they are different and, if finances are limited, it could surely conceivably come down to a choice between the two? I know others on SL1 have suggested in the past that they would invest in taking over the SL1 version of the game but has anyone on SL2 checked to see if any individual (or group) would be be willing to take that version forward separately? Just a thought.
Yes it's been discussed on SL2 also. During times when junior has ignored users some have discussed getting a consortium together to make an offer much the same as on here. We've also had a user offer his time free of charge to fix bugs. There's not really much difference between both sites. Both get ignored by those who run the franchise....and both have been underdeveloped and advertised.
As for many of the changes suggested by Deca. Some you list above are already available on SL2. Larger squads....the ability to sell players and pitch development. The ability to watch matches before seeing the result was a great inclusion too. Thing is....if you want the simplicity of SL1 with just some added features, that product is already there and has been since 2011.
I think we really need some conversation with Mustafa if his talks with Junior prove successful. Everyone needs to come together and decide exactly what they want from Sundayleague as a product in General. I believe Terry had a great vision to bring this game up to date with other online apps. Sadly we will never know the full extent of his ideas but I do believe discussion will bring us closer to what we all want as a community.
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Just wondering who plays both. Regularly. And with equal commitment of time and funds?
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Some fantastic ideas Deca.
I don't want to start going into proper details into what I am going to do to improve SL until proper talks with Junior are happening with vast improvements and productivity. There's no point saying this and that until SL is in my hands as I don't want to get people's hopes up.
I am still awaiting another reply from Junior. I have only received one email from him in which I will share. I sent an email trying to sort out a meeting. Since then I have not heard anything back. I have sent another email to Junior last Friday 26th Oct. I'm hoping Junior will reply back to me sometime this week.
Everything just depends on Junior. From the email he sent, it shows he is willing to discuss further and sell. The quicker he replies back to me, the quicker talks can be, the quicker I can take over, the quicker SL becomes better.
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Good news. I have received another email from Junior today.
Will be having a call with him tomorrow.
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Just wondering who plays both. Regularly. And with equal commitment of time and funds?
I play both. I have to admit I only play SL1 as a non supporter but I did have millions of credits when the servers merged, so I've just been using those up ever since. I left when SL2 started and I didn't really start playing again until a few seasons ago. Id just been keeping teams alive because of history. I think there are about 5 other users who play both versions actively. Not sure how many invest in both.
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Good news. I have received another email from Junior today.
Will be having a call with him tomorrow.
Looking forward to hearing how this goes.
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Thanks Mustapha for keeping us all posted on events, and hope the talks go well with Junior,
Could be the start of an exciting new chapter for the game :) :)
Cheers
Deca
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Hi guys, a quick update:
I had a very good call with Junior over the phone on yesterday and today we had a meeting at my office.
Talks have been really good and positive so far... Junior and myself are eager to collaborate and help each other in regards to improving SL as a whole. We both feel this is the best thing to do. Junior is not looking to sell SL completely and to be honest, I would want Junior to stay as he knows the game inside out, more than anyone and having him part of the team would be indispensable.
I am willing to invest money into SL to cover several key points.
The first thing to do would be to recode the whole game (SL1) in order to fix key issues that is currently on going with the game. This is a must as firstly, the backend has been coded with C++ which in this day is not good nor strong enough. We will have to change this and use a different language such as PHP (just like SL2) as this will improve SL1 as a whole and make it easier to fix any problems. Secondly other issues such as the match engine will have to be refined in order for a better customer experience. As you know, the match engine is not the best at this current moment and for this I would need the SL community to write down and explain what they feel the match engine needs improving on (formations, subs, tactical approach etc). Once these maintenance issues have been cleared (please also let me know of all issues that you feel is affecting the SL as a whole and how can we improve these). I have a shit load of developers who are willing to do all of this and I will be with them step by step to make sure everything is done correctly and efficiently.
Once these main issues have been cleared, we then focus onto bringing more users via advertising and marketing. There is no point doing this first as I don't want new users signing up to a broken game and then leaving after a week or whatever. I have a marketing team that can assist in this along with some valuable connections. LADBible office is located in the same building as mine and I have spoken to some workers there regarding advertising. Moreover we will use social media such as twitter and Instagram to promote SL in order to create some noise. Not to mention also that the CEO of the company i'm correctly working in knows the owners of a well known and established betting company. We then look at ways of expanding the game such as adding new features and creating a mobile app.
Junior will be sending me documentation so that I can look at it and pass it on my team. We will be scheduling another call for the end of next week. So far so good guys and I am happy I have been able to progress regarding this. Also a big thank you to Junior who did respond to me and allow further talks.
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That's great news and sounds promising. Well done Kush & Junior.
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Brilliant news Guys,
And great we are all being kept updated on progress :) :)
Hope all goes well in the next exciting phase for SL
Cheers
Deca
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Great news Kush, props for actually sticking with this and actually managing to get through to Junior.
Sounds promising, look forward to hearing more as it develops.
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That's really good news Kush! I must admit i didn't have much hope in you getting through to Junior.
Hope all goes well :)
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Great news! Good luck with this Mustapha. Now I know where your office is.... I'll pop in for a brew one day I'm in the city ;)
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Thanks for the support from all... It is really highly appreciated and I am happy to see some managers getting excited. Will keep on updating everyone.
Ty, your welcome anytime my friend. It would be an absolute pleasure to have a brew with you :D
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Not had the time to get on much so that was a interesting read.
Will draw up a list of the niggling issues etc I know of if this does progress into happening.
Best of luck Kush. :)
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Sorry guys for the lack of of updates recently. Been really busy with work and travelling up and down the UK. I’m currently in Perth Scotland, tomorrow Edinburgh for two days and then Glasgow. It’s been a hectic last couple of weeks but work is work!
After further talks with Junior, it is best to start on the front end first and then we can focus on the back end once that is done. Had a brief meeting with my team last week to discuss this and we have begun to map things out but obviously I need to be with them the majority of the time as I know SL and they don’t and without my aid, they will find it difficult. Will be having another meet up towards the end of this week and then I will be able to give you all a proper update and structure.
Thanks once again for all the support. It is highly appreciated and I will always be grateful.
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As Christopher Biggins used to say many years ago in a kid's tv show ... safari so goodie. :)
All sounding great atm and yes well done Kush for your efforts and Junior for agreeing to positive talks. If it helps, it's my birthday on 22nd - what a great present it would be if this could be signed, sealed, delivered by then ... as the song goes. :P :D
Good luck for future discussions.
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im sitting here quietly reading and watching..... i have many questions when i finally read Mustapha`s business plan....
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Hi guys,
firstly I would like to apologise for not being in touch regarding what is happening. I have been incredibly busy as of late but work has started to cool down a bit thankfully.
I think I explained in a previous post that Junior has recommended to begin work on the front end of the game i.e the design and how the website will look like. Me and my team will begin this process by the start of next week. You guys will have to bear with me as this may take some time and at the same time I have other work commitments that I must do. I am hoping to wrap up the design part as soon as possible but at the moment I can't give a guarantee timeline but personally I'm hoping it shouldn't take more than a couple of months for this part to be completed.
The main objective of the new design will be;
1) Keep it as simple as possible just like how SL1 is now. Easy to understand, play and roam around the game. So basically it will be a similar to what we have currently now but will be massively updated in terms of how the game looks.
2) Integrate more compulsory competitions such as the TCL, Europa League, champions of champions and possibly a few others. This will be automatic every season and a private league will not have to be created for these type of competitions.
3) Team management - Thinking of adding a few more players to the overall squad so from 20 to 22-23? This will allow managers to be able to use different formations in a easier manner. At the same time subs will be increased from 5 to 7. This will help the issue of the subs bug but of course when developing the engine of the game (back-end) this will be cleared up.
4) Tactics - possibilty of adding more pitches and weather conditions. Let me know what you guys think about this and what your ideas are? I am open to all suggestions and if it makes sense and everyone in the community agrees, we can do it. SL2 added lots of other perks during games but I was not really a fan of this but I want the view from everybody in the community and if you feel something extra would boost the game, please engage.
5) What is everyone's view about advanced tactics? Would you like more events to be added etc? Please do let me know.
6) Community - upgrade address book and messaging system (able to send multiple messages at the same time) makes it easier when setting up private league competitions such as the friendly league.
7) Transfer market - Add more players including special players that can play both attacking and normal positions. Improve how the transfer market currently looks and a better way of filtering the players on the market.
8) Team details - Choose a kit from the list or be able to create your very own kit just like in SL2. Make team profile more fancy (also be able to upload an image as your managers picture along with options if you don't want to upload). Make the team history page look epic... I know a lot of managers are still playing now cause of their history and this should not be forgotten at all. You should be proud of your history and will look into this properly.
These are just some things that I currently have down. I am open to all ideas as said and will need help from you guys regarding this and what you think can help make the game better. I will keep everyone in touch regarding the designs and can even upload them when they are finished in order to get everyone's view.
Thanks.
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Great to hear there will be some development.
Improving the way we move around the game to make it more efficient, so quicker to set up will be good. i'd like to be able to save some default formations so as not have to rearrange all my players every time i swap formations.
I'm not sure about the merits of having more players in the squad. Developing a squad with the current number of players leads to some interesting decisions and is a key part of the strategy for me.
Players that can play in more than one position is a good idea. An alternative to this might be to not penalise them so much for playing in the wrong position. I would prefer their performance to be based on their stats rather than their nominal position. Eg a midfielder who is a good tackler shouldn't be penalised for playing in defence if he has all the attributes for this. I think this alternative might help even more with the "subs bug" which i don't think is a bug at all but is really just the result of clever thinking by one manager who realised that subs later in the game due to injury might get put into the wrong positions and penalised .. so he started doing it earlier, into the right positions, meaning players were never played out of position, excepting cockups, and this tactic caught on. In real life players play in the positions that they have the skills for, not the nominal position that they call themselves.
Making a big deal of the history is a great idea as is incorporating the CL etc into the game itself.
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I should say that I would be in favour of more events to use advanced tactics although I'm not sure what the impact will be. It might just make it more random ( eg scissors beats paper beats rock more often ). there are some options that don't exist at the moment which I would like to use eg If Drawing. ( as an addition to if winning, if losing, if not winning, if not losing) .
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I like the idea of the compulsory leagues like the Europa league etc. This would make leagues more interesting to the end of the season. Sometimes the last four of five games can be a little boring if you have little to play for.
I the idea of a bigger squad, maybe to 22 players. I think that would be enough. Players playing in multiple positions sounds like a very good idea too.
As someone who has tried to organise competitions in the past, the ability to send one message to multiple players would be very useful.
Lastly, the transfer market is a big problem. Any changes here would be welcome, it cannot be any worse than what it currently is.
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Excellent news Kush, really is......
I'm so busy at the moment myself, but will wait until the week-end to put my views forwards and suggestions, rather than rush them now :-)
Regards
Deca
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most of these suggestions are already running on SL2
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8.Team details - Choose a kit from the list or be able to create your very own kit just like in SL2.
I'd quite liked the (purely cosmetic) feature of choosing your own colours from one of the SL kit templates on SL2. To go one better the introduction of a RGB colour pad would give you more choice of colours too - to me the "design your own shirt" feature was ok but threw up a lot of scruffy designs, making the landing pages quite garish to be honest. I'd much prefer every user having one of the pre-existing templates but choosing their own colours for a unique strip. It's just a matter of opinion I guess!
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most of these suggestions are already running on SL2
Sorry Kush. I love your enthusiasm of pushing the game forward but Skally is correct. Think were going away from SL1 here.
IMO the areas that need tackling are
- The bug fixes on the layout etc is good.. Pages that don't work.
- Match engine needs looking into. A few tweaks. Think the subs rubbish needs to go. Make it something like you can't make a sub till 45th min at earliest or something. Formations made more important along with morale and gelling. Shouldnt just be build a monster team with attributes. Not a massive swing like SL2 where the ganes are 6-5. Just a slight tweak into taking into account all factors.
- integration of new competitions is good
- get rid of cannon fodder on the market. Making more players available
- make friendlies more important and the only way to get training! Why not schedule everyone a full list at beginning of season? Random generation. Luck of draw. Everyone has the same boost.
- most importantly is help new managers. There need to be a basic user guide on any game to help keep new managers here. People just come and go
All about keeping it simple for new and old managers otherwise may aswell go on SL2.
Thats just a few opinions off top of my head. Will have a bigger think.
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I like Borg's suggestions on the user guide for new managers. This is very important.
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Thanks for all the feedback.
This is exactly why I have asked for feedback and advice from the community. I don't want to go away from SL1 at all and want to keep it virtually the same but just updated in terms of actual game play along with some new features that will benefit all such as new compulsory competitions etc. I know many managers love this game due to its simplicity including myself and this is something I am taking into account. We don't want a complex game at all and I am not looking to make SL1 into another version of SL2.
Borg, please let me know which pages are not working.
I will compile a list of what needs to be fixed using the feedback from the community.
In terms of the layout of SL1 (design)... Is everyone happy with how it currently looks? For example, Is there anything else you would like on the main club house page or anywhere else?
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In terms of the layout of SL1 (design)... Is everyone happy with how it currently looks? For example, Is there anything else you would like on the main club house page or anywhere else?
Answering this specifically. When setting advance tactics I would like to be able to see my starting tactics ( which are currently on a different page) and my team line up ( so i know where to put my subs)
A summary of what is currently happening in training eg rest or rehab on the home page would be a useful reminder.
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In terms of the layout of SL1 (design)... Is everyone happy with how it currently looks? For example, Is there anything else you would like on the main club house page or anywhere else?
Answering this specifically. When setting advance tactics I would like to be able to see my starting tactics ( which are currently on a different page) and my team line up ( so i know where to put my subs)
A summary of what is currently happening in training eg rest or rehab on the home page would be a useful reminder.
I agree on the tactics front. Why have two different screens? There seems little reason for that.
On training, how about being able to set up a long term training plan? That way i would not forget to change from nice rest to rehab and also i would not forget adjust by main training.
I also wonder what benefit there is to keeping the pub crawl option? I doubt that anyone actually sends their players to the beach either.
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I am sorry for poaching this SL thread, but there are some great managers on Senior League Hockey who would appreciate someone making that game better. It is now frozen and we cannot play the game. It would be great if you can consider taking on our game also.
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In terms of the layout of SL1 (design)... Is everyone happy with how it currently looks? For example, Is there anything else you would like on the main club house page or anywhere else?
Answering this specifically. When setting advance tactics I would like to be able to see my starting tactics ( which are currently on a different page) and my team line up ( so i know where to put my subs)
A summary of what is currently happening in training eg rest or rehab on the home page would be a useful reminder.
I agree on the tactics front. Why have two different screens? There seems little reason for that.
On training, how about being able to set up a long term training plan? That way i would not forget to change from nice rest to rehab and also i would not forget adjust by main training.
I also wonder what benefit there is to keeping the pub crawl option? I doubt that anyone actually sends their players to the beach either.
How about "Shagging brother's wife"; "Shagging team-mates wives" and/or "Shagging (with or without team-mates) a silly little close-to-being-under-age Wannabe whether she says no or not"? You can't say those things don't happen? ;)
Hopefully the language (and thought) is mild enough but if it offends anyone I will apologise and amend or remove it.
PS The last sentence does not apply to manu or chels fans --- or anyone who is related to the type of female mentioned.
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I am sorry for poaching this SL thread, but there are some great managers on Senior League Hockey who would appreciate someone making that game better. It is now frozen and we cannot play the game. It would be great if you can consider taking on our game also.
Hi alablues,
I have never played SLH before and I have no idea about how the game plays etc.
I understand where your coming from... At the moment, I am focused on upgrading SL1. When I did have a meeting with Junior, he did mention that SLH is still up and running and hasn't been dropped like the formula1 and cricket games.
How many managers are currently still playing SLH (rough approximation)?
I have no problems looking into this but at the moment my focus is currently just on SL1 and with my time being limited due to other work and commitments, it will be hard for me to work on SL1 and SLH simultaneously. I will however keep tabs and look into this when I can. I will create an account once the game is playable again. How long has the game been frozen for and have you contacted Junior regarding this?
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I am sorry for poaching this SL thread, but there are some great managers on Senior League Hockey who would appreciate someone making that game better. It is now frozen and we cannot play the game. It would be great if you can consider taking on our game also.
Hi alablues,
I have never played SLH before and I have no idea about how the game plays etc.
I understand where your coming from... At the moment, I am focused on upgrading SL1. When I did have a meeting with Junior, he did mention that SLH is still up and running and hasn't been dropped like the formula1 and cricket games.
How many managers are currently still playing SLH (rough approximation)?
I have no problems looking into this but at the moment my focus is currently just on SL1 and with my time being limited due to other work and commitments, it will be hard for me to work on SL1 and SLH simultaneously. I will however keep tabs and look into this when I can. I will create an account once the game is playable again. How long has the game been frozen for and have you contacted Junior regarding this?
I messaged junior on Friday informing him SLH was broken. No response though.
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Im still a tad confused, prob my old age. Am i right in saying " SL2 was made to improve SL1?" so why do SL1 users hate SL2 so much? like i have said most of the upgrades, tweaks and suggestions are allready running on SL2.... so what do SL1 managers actually want?
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Im still a tad confused, prob my old age. Am i right in saying " SL2 was made to improve SL1?" so why do SL1 users hate SL2 so much? like i have said most of the upgrades, tweaks and suggestions are allready running on SL2.... so what do SL1 managers actually want?
I think SL1 users like some of the changes that were made to SL2 but don't like others. I suppose the perfect world is somewhere in between the two games.
Of course, what we all would like is someone in game management to run the games. This is the most frustrating part. We spend our money for little or no service.
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SL2 and SL1 managers need to bash our heads and work out what we really want from the game
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This is the reason to why I have asked the community for feedback and what they would like to see in the future for SL1.... If I’m honest I’m quite disappointed as I expected way more people to join the thread/chat and write down what they feel would improve SL1 but it is what it is. I thank everyone who has contributed so far and given me valuable information.
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so what do SL1 managers actually want?
Evidently a version that isn't like SL2. Reading this thread it seems the majority would want the SL1 interface to remain the same / similar with slight changes here and there rather than a complete overhaul.
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This is the reason to why I have asked the community for feedback and what they would like to see in the future for SL1.... If I’m honest I’m quite disappointed as I expected way more people to join the thread/chat and write down what they feel would improve SL1 but it is what it is. I thank everyone who has contributed so far and given me valuable information.
Less players than you would expect actually use the forum. I have noticed this when trying to start private leagues. Unless you send messages to players, you wll get few replies.
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I have a lot of ideas that i'd like to share and post, but there are 2 things that i would like to see that could have an immediate impact on SL1
1. Removing the advertising in the game as it slows me down no end.
2. A decent Christmas break, say 2 weeks shut down, that would give the developers time to have a look at things whilst the game is paused for Christmas
I'll post my own aspirations for short and long term soon, but think i already posted some on this thread
Regards
Deca
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I have a lot of ideas that i'd like to share and post, but there are 2 things that i would like to see that could have an immediate impact on SL1
1. Removing the advertising in the game as it slows me down no end.
2. A decent Christmas break, say 2 weeks shut down, that would give the developers time to have a look at things whilst the game is paused for Christmas
I'll post my own aspirations for short and long term soon, but think i already posted some on this thread
Regards
Deca
Wouldn't removing advertising punish younger/poorer/part time players as, without it, costs and therefore prices to players would surely rise?
Why is the advertising slowing you down? I've never noticed any slow-downs (except maybe just before KOs when there might be many players doing last-minute changes). Just wondering.
And as for a break, absolutely. Two weeks, four weeks, six weeks --- whatever it takes to do it properly and not just get it done to get it up and running ASAP with the likelihood of breakdowns as various glitches show up and need fixing. No disrepect with whoever might be working on the repairs but ........ ;)
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Yes, apologies, I meant to say it would be nice to turn off advertising, i.e. have the option,
Although realise it may not be possible due to income it generates for the game.
I just find it distracting :)
Regards
Deca
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Thanks once again for all who have participated and offered great feedback.
At the moment I am currently working on the design for the new SL1. I am not actually looking into the technical side of the game (match engine, gameplay etc).. That will be saved for later after the front-end display and design side has been accomplished. Please don't worry though as I am aim to be doing everything that needs to be fixed.
The codebase is in excess of 25,000 lines and is split into multiple files with many clauses so it's not going to be a walk in the park and things will take time. I am going to have to understand how the game plays via these lines and clauses. As I am working on the front-end, Junior will be putting together a bit more flesh on to the game loop as this will make it easier for me to understand how the game is ticking. The same thing with the match engine; There are so many systems and routines that get called and I can't start this from scratch because if I did, the game won't play the same. Junior has said we would have to use an evolution of the SL2 engine but with SL1 variables. The reason why we use the SL2 engine is because this is the more uptodate game loop and most likely explains the how the engine should tick over in a better way.
So for this it is easier to work from the front end first in order to be clear on what we want it to function like and how the data is manipulated. This alone will take a while to do but will try to get it done as soon as possible.
Thanks.
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Yes, apologies, I meant to say it would be nice to turn off advertising, i.e. have the option,
Although realise it may not be possible due to income it generates for the game.
I just find it distracting :)
Regards
Deca
I find opponents beating me a distraction.
Where's MY button? ;)
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It has been a while since we heard any feedback. Granted Christmas was a distraction for much of that time but I'm just wondering if there has been any progress.
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It has been a while since we heard any feedback. Granted Christmas was a distraction for much of that time but I'm just wondering if there has been any progress.
Hi Cove,
Sorry for the late reply. I have been busy of late and hardly been checking the forums.
I do apologise for not giving feedback any sooner.
At the moment, things are going slow. I have started the design of the new SL1 but it's going slower than expected. I am more or less doing this on my own now. I do have a team but they are failing to understand how this game plays. They want to add many features and integrations to the game but as we all know, this game was made to be played in a simple way and should more or less be kept the same with just a few tweaks and improvements. For this, I am more or less doing the design on my own for the very time being.
I am only investing around 3-4 hours a week into the new SL1 as I am really busy with work along with a few other projects that I am involved in. I did say that the design should take around 2 months to competition, but it is very more than likely that it's going to take longer. Also it doesn't help seeing that day by day, SL1 is gradually decreasing in terms of functionality and the amount of users/managers playing. We had 4 FL leagues last season compared to just 3 now and it seems that managers are losing their passion for the game. When seeing these things happen, unfortunately it decreases my motivation. Not to mention also the amount of feedback I was given when I asked the community for their opinion and help was very low. I understand not many managers are active on the forums but I still felt there should have been more. That's just my opinion anyway.
I will keep on working on the design and front end part and see what the future holds.
Thanks.
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Hello Kush,
Thanks for your reply. I think we are all very frustrated at the moment which is why a lot of managers have fallen away. Fall off happens naturally but at the moment, new managers cannot join as when they register, their accounts need to be verified by sundayleague. This does not seem to be happening which means we have no new recruits coming on board.
It is the new players that add renewed interest to the game. It gets boring if you play the same team three times in a day, (which happened to me a few weeks ago). I think this is something you could look at as a priority.
I suspect that access to the forum is also a problem which might be why so few are using it at the moment.
Lastly, if we had regular updates, from you or junior, maybe every 2 or 3 weeks, or if there were small changes that we could all see, I think that would help to keep people interested. I suspect that most people are becoming disillusioned becuase they see no one driving the game. If this changed, then I think people's morale would improve drastically which in turn might help to improve your own motivation.
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Spot on Cove, Couldn't agree more,
Small regular changes makes sense, and will show the game is developing, improving the game will soon bring those that have left back
Cheers
Deca
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Hello Kush,
Thanks for your reply. I think we are all very frustrated at the moment which is why a lot of managers have fallen away. Fall off happens naturally but at the moment, new managers cannot join as when they register, their accounts need to be verified by sundayleague. This does not seem to be happening which means we have no new recruits coming on board.
It is the new players that add renewed interest to the game. It gets boring if you play the same team three times in a day, (which happened to me a few weeks ago). I think this is something you could look at as a priority.
I suspect that access to the forum is also a problem which might be why so few are using it at the moment.
Lastly, if we had regular updates, from you or junior, maybe every 2 or 3 weeks, or if there were small changes that we could all see, I think that would help to keep people interested. I suspect that most people are becoming disillusioned becuase they see no one driving the game. If this changed, then I think people's morale would improve drastically which in turn might help to improve your own motivation.
Hi Eamonn,
I echo everything you say.
Regarding your comment with the forum issue for new members, I have just sent a text message, a WhatsApp message, an instant message via Facebook messenger and an email to the two active email addresses I have for Junior. I am hoping that there is a solution to this problem as the forum is key to in game communication.
Fingers crossed 8) :) 8)
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Think there is bigger things to worry about than the forum personally. Like actually letting managers joining the game verify ttheir accounts. At the moment no new manager sticks about as the verify email isn’t coming through. So people are joining then instantly leaving. Couple that with current managers leaving the game is going down the pan.
What I will say about the forum is that it needs to go back in game like it was before and is on SL2. It is constantly being spammed by bots. Between 4pm and 8pm it had 30 requests. As I write this it has had another 4 more!!!! I have a photo but it is too big to attach. This goes on all day. Easily 200 requests a day from spammers.
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Read your first post on this thread Kush and remind yourself why you got the ball rolling in terms of improving SL, we need you firing on all cylinders! Since I went back to work on the 2nd December I haven't had a lot of time - my forum activity has suffered but I'm still here lurking in the shadows. Hope you can get the optimism back.
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I have just emailed Junior telling him of the current problems that need to be resolved asap.
1) Sign up verification - I can create a new registration/sign up page that will work and give any new users all confirmation needed.
2) Team/extended history - Season progress needs to be fixed along with extended history as some users don't have that page anymore.
3) Forum that is integrated on the SL1 website and not external like the current one.
I have told Junior that if he has no time due to other work commitments to fix theses, I can attempt to do them as soon as possible.
Waiting to hear back from Junior.
Thanks.
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thanks Kush, i may be quiet but your effort is appreciated
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Think there is bigger things to worry about than the forum personally. Like actually letting managers joining the game verify ttheir accounts. At the moment no new manager sticks about as the verify email isn’t coming through. So people are joining then instantly leaving. Couple that with current managers leaving the game is going down the pan.
What I will say about the forum is that it needs to go back in game like it was before and is on SL2. It is constantly being spammed by bots. Between 4pm and 8pm it had 30 requests. As I write this it has had another 4 more!!!! I have a photo but it is too big to attach. This goes on all day. Easily 200 requests a day from spammers.
I agree with you Borg. Junior has responded to my text message saying:
"Thanks James. I'll have a look. Do you have any of their usernames?".
If anyone can help with this that would help Junior with looking into this forum bug. I have also asked him if he can look into new account verification email bug - will keep you posted if I get any updates.
Many thanks
Jimbo.
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I have just emailed Junior telling him of the current problems that need to be resolved asap.
1) Sign up verification - I can create a new registration/sign up page that will work and give any new users all confirmation needed.
2) Team/extended history - Season progress needs to be fixed along with extended history as some users don't have that page anymore.
3) Forum that is integrated on the SL1 website and not external like the current one.
I have told Junior that if he has no time due to other work commitments to fix theses, I can attempt to do them as soon as possible.
Waiting to hear back from Junior.
Thanks.
Thank you for your help and efforts Kush. If those three key points can be actioned then that would be a great solution to some of the problems.
Many thanks
Jimbo.
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This is deeply concerning.
As many of you will know I've advocated the sell-on of the game for a few years now to parties that are more willing and able to host, support and develop the platform.
I've offered my own services on a number of occasions and was overjoyed to see Kush take up the mantle with a view to incorporating positive change.
However, if you have a service that new members cannot sign up to due to a functional code failure, then this is potentially catastrophic.
This issue must be P1 for Junior, Kush or anyone else who has direct access to the code.
!!! FIX THIS FIRST !!!
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This is deeply concerning.
As many of you will know I've advocated the sell-on of the game for a few years now to parties that are more willing and able to host, support and develop the platform.
I've offered my own services on a number of occasions and was overjoyed to see Kush take up the mantle with a view to incorporating positive change.
However, if you have a service that new members cannot sign up to due to a functional code failure, then this is potentially catastrophic.
This issue must be P1 for Junior, Kush or anyone else who has direct access to the code.
!!! FIX THIS FIRST !!!
I completely understand and I’m with you all the way.
I know that Junior is busy with other commitments and I am more than willing to solve these issues ASAP. We cannot have a game where new users are not able to sign up accordingly and this is very worrying.
Junior doesn’t want to sell 100% of his share and I can understand this from his point of view but after some discussion and a face to face meeting, we came to an agreement where I and my team would get involved and help out and see what happens in the future. The progress I am doing is slow progress but it is better than no progress.
I am not willing to put time, effort and money into this if this is the case and these major issues are not fixed. as there is no point as the game will only go downhill but I am here to help and solve issues currently in game ASAP and I am even willing to put my own money down to improve situations for the community.
I will wait for a reply from Junior by end of day Monday and if no response, I will call him. Just to let you peeps also know; I don’t have any access to any code or frameworks for SL1.
I will try everything I can to solve these issues. I have made a promise to change the game and I will not go back on that as I am a man of my word.
Thanks.
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The progress I am doing is slow progress but it is better than no progress.
I think any progress would be great progress so good luck with it Kush. I hope Junior answers the phone!
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Would be nice to have the SSL cert renewed on the website as well Kush. Could you mention this to Junior as well ?
Cheers
Globus
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hey Kush. I can understand that Junior didn't want sell 100% of his share but in the end that would be down to what is offered. Are we talking single figure thousands or tens of thousands? Given the interest in this game from the people who play i ( and the lack of interest/ commitment from those who own it), is there an opportunity for a consortium of players to buy it..would junior sell if the offer was right? Also, is his share 100% or do others own part of the game, too? Is Junior's share enough to give control if it was bought?
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Great Idea,
SL developed and owned by the people that play the game day in aand day out, apart from when the system is broken :)
Cheers
Deca
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Another thing I forgot to mention was whether SL going forward could benefit from some kind of member ownership of the game.
The brief video below succinctly explains how football trusts work in the professional game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-2lPxgtC60
Deca & Davidvangaal, I touched upon this issue on page 2 of this thread. You may find the video above interesting!
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hey Kush. I can understand that Junior didn't want sell 100% of his share but in the end that would be down to what is offered. Are we talking single figure thousands or tens of thousands? Given the interest in this game from the people who play i ( and the lack of interest/ commitment from those who own it), is there an opportunity for a consortium of players to buy it..would junior sell if the offer was right? Also, is his share 100% or do others own part of the game, too? Is Junior's share enough to give control if it was bought?
Hi David,
When I had a meeting with Junior, we did not go into proper detail on percentages etc after he told me he was not willing to sell 100%. We mainly talked on how to improve the game and how me and my team could get involved to assist. Once there was actual improvements and issues being solved, we then would talk about stakes and % but it hasn't come to that point yet.
From what I remember, Junior owns 100%. There was a huge debt a couple of years ago (I think around £40-50K)in which Junior paid all of it. Legal action was threatened on Terry's wife at the time and if the debt wasn't going to be collected it would have been very problematic for the family. For this Junior got involved and paid all the debt off and therefore has 100% stake. I am not sure how much Junior is willing to sell but I do remember for a fact it wouldn't be the whole 100%. Some sort of collaboration would be suited best. Since Junior paid a 5 figure sum to cover the debt, I see no way of him accepting anything less if he was to sell 100% and for SL at this very moment of time, there is no way anyone would pay that much to take full control including myself.
I was told that the reason why the game went downhill is due to the fact that Junior is the only person running the game and along with work and other commitments, does not have the time to do everything on his own. I understand the time constraints as I am in a similar boat myself as I'm working full time and I am involved in various projects. This has resulted in me spending time on designing a new SL1 to a minimum of approx a few hours a week.
Even though I have Juniors contact details, it is still very difficult to get in contact with him and I'm sure others here can vouch on that also. I wouldn't see a problem if a consortium of players were to get involved and buy a certain stake in the company and I would be very interested in participating. It would be awesome to work with members of the community and take this game forward as my team have struggled to come to terms on the gameplay of SL1 resulting in me mainly trying to design something myself. Having a team that know the game inside out and know what problems need to be fixed would truly be indispensable.
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kush
Thanks. That all makes sense and the position is much clearer. I have a background in business but not in IT. I can understand that Junior would want to get back the debt he paid off plus some more and he deserves too also as not only as he been part of this great game since it was launched but he has also looked after Terry's family.
I wonder if we could identify the skills that are needed to take the game forward and enquire if anybody playing the game has them and the time to contribute? Although there are niggles with the game, they are not massive, and do not stop it being enjoyed. The biggest improvement would be responsive management. If that could be improved it would make a lot of people happier.. people spending money expect engagement from the company. It needs to be more than just a customer interface role that gives bland messages though...the person doing it must have the ability and access to fix things themselves. I wonder what language the game is coded in and whether anybody here has the skills to manage it? They don't need to change the coding yet, just administer it and keep it runnning, and make sure that new customers can sign up etc.
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kush
Thanks. That all makes sense and the position is much clearer. I have a background in business but not in IT. I can understand that Junior would want to get back the debt he paid off plus some more and he deserves too also as not only as he been part of this great game since it was launched but he has also looked after Terry's family.
I wonder if we could identify the skills that are needed to take the game forward and enquire if anybody playing the game has them and the time to contribute? Although there are niggles with the game, they are not massive, and do not stop it being enjoyed. The biggest improvement would be responsive management. If that could be improved it would make a lot of people happier.. people spending money expect engagement from the company. It needs to be more than just a customer interface role that gives bland messages though...the person doing it must have the ability and access to fix things themselves. I wonder what language the game is coded in and whether anybody here has the skills to manage it? They don't need to change the coding yet, just administer it and keep it runnning, and make sure that new customers can sign up etc.
David,
To answer what you have just said; if you was to search the previous pages of this thread, I am sure you will see what you are looking for.
Junior sent me a document late last year showing what needs to be done: I have copied and pasted content of the document here:
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Sundayleague Plans
Here are some of my thoughts on the current state of Sundayleague and my plans on how it can change.
Current Constraints:
- Time. I do not have the luxury of the time I used to have to devote to developing this game much further in a realistic timeframe on my own.
- Funds. I do not have the funds to allow me to market the game sufficiently and promote it once the necessary work is completed.
- Contacts. I do not have the contacts to forge strategic partnerships that will propel the game like we did in the past (in a short space of time).
Going Forward
- I have a general idea of how I wanted to see SundayLeague develop.
- The game will have to be re-coded from scratch using a new engine in order to fix any existing bugs and allow for easy fixing of any new ones.
- A graphic artist / designer will need to be worked with to create some mock ups of updated new screens.
- Artist may be needed to create any artwork needed in the Sundayleague comic style.
- A discussion needs to take place on how programming work will be handled and led, If I’m on board for this.
- A plan for the changes and modifications is needed and some rough timeframes.
Programming & Development
- Aim would be to convert the engine and front-end from running in C++ / Perl to PHP, which will aid in several areas.
- Create multiple configurable options to aid in fine-tuning.
- Have a small team of beta-testers that are not biased
- Have multiple personnel working on the game via GitHub etc.
Server
- Linux cPanel/WHM (Centos 7.x 64Bit) 4gb ram 60 GB SSD SSL
- Hosted with EUKHost.com, who have excellent support.
- No need to change this arrangement at present.
Current Setup
- Game backend (C++ game engine that runs on a Cron script twice a day and exports data to txt files which are imported into a MySQL database)
- Game frontend (Perl scripts that load html template files and manipulate data from the MySQL database)
Limitations:
- Very problematic to debug backend (several minutes to compile game engine, then several more to run and load the datafiles, then to test a single issue)
- Slightly antiquated programming language setup (Perl system is a bit outdated as well as the backend C++ game engine setup)
- Very hard to debug front-end also.
- Not scalable. Adding more than 4096 teams breaks the system
- C++ code not compiled in over 10 years.
Proposed setup
- Game backend (PHP that runs every minute in time-slices with direct connection to database)
- Game frontend (PHP scripts with possible front controller that loads separate html templates and manipulates data from database)*
Benefits:
- Very easy to debug game engine on development machines. (relatively instant, as there is no compiling or loading of data)
- PHP is a well-supported language and combined with XDebug, development is easier.
- Scalable. The Game architecture does not have to revolve around 4096 teams playing once a day. (You can have instant games if you want with real players for example)
- Some of the R&D already completed and works.
OTHER PLATFORMS
Facebook
- An attempt was made to integrate with Facebook with SL2. It worked briefly before Facebook changed to their API and work then ceased on my part
- More research is needed to get the SSO working again, alongside skinning and payment systems integration.
- Not enough time spent on Facebook and no marketing was done to see if we could capitalize on the casual gamer with SL2, but this could change for SundayLeague
Mobile Web
- The front-end can potentially work with a mobile skin as well as for a traditional browser.
- Relatively simple with today’s technology to create a responsive web version (Bootstrap etc).
Mobile App
- When last checked, there were a few ways we could have a mobile app that interfaced with the game server
- A mobile app could be free to download, but attract a brand new stream of players
- We had plans for a simple single-player game also to beef up a mobile app
o Quick match
o League
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Hi Kush,
Thanks for sharing this for all of us to see, it's quite detailed, and explains clearly what needs to happen, and what skills are needed to be involved,
it also shows what a tremendous amount of work this entails, and why it will take so long if not able to have a full time committment to developing the game.
it will be interesting to see the views of others, and whether any have the required skill sets.
Regards
Deca
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Thanks Kush
Thats very interesting and encouraging. Clearly a lot more thought than was apparent and there is a desire to do something, tempered by real, practical issues.
Unfortunately I don't have any skills to contribute to the development stage. When its done I may be interested in contributing to a marketing budget if the product looks good and if there is a viable business plan .
Maybe others on here would too?
Keep going mate.
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Similarly to DVG, I can't help from a development stage although I work with a couple of developers who I may be able to get to assist in some capacity (one in particular).
Where I may be able to help is from a partnership point of view as this is my everyday job - I speak fairly regularly with the partnership teams at a few Prem / EFL clubs although I'm almost certain that for them to allow us to use licences / IP you would need to agree to a revenue share model. Facebook is the wrong avenue to market this product at, with the price that you have to pay to boost any posts to make them relevant to your target demographic, there are various other avenues that would be more worthwhile. PPC and SEO are the most important initial aspects, making sure that SL is one of the first sites when users search for "online football management" or "football management games" would almost certainly drive more users to the site, especially when combined with what Kush is currently doing from a front-end perspective in terms of making sure players are able to sign-up.
Great to see you're still going with this Kush.
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I don't have any programming skills :( well apart from Visual Basic for Excel!!
But I'm a wizard with Excel & Data manipulation :)
Not sure that is part of what's required though :(
Cheers
Deca
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Like many others, I have no programming skills at all. I have done a fair bit of beta testing on various projects however although that's probably a long way off yet. I am encouraged also by the post from Junior. Fascinating to read all that and marvelled at the scope of thought Junior's obviously been putting in despite a lack of communication on his part 'hiding' that from most, if not all, of us. As the song went, things can only get better so good luck Kush and I look forward very much to hear how things are going from hereon in.
Cheers, Nick
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Kush, any news?
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Kush, any news?
Hi Gull,
Not really any upgraded news to mention.
Still designing but I just don't have the time to commit to this on a full time basis at the moment. I am currently dealing with 3 different projects at work and I'm literally working 6 days a week with hardly any rest but that's life I guess and I can't complain. I'll upload some of the website design I have created along with some sort of timeline by the end of the month.
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Think there is bigger things to worry about than the forum personally. Like actually letting managers joining the game verify ttheir accounts. At the moment no new manager sticks about as the verify email isn’t coming through. So people are joining then instantly leaving. Couple that with current managers leaving the game is going down the pan.
Hi Everyone,
As a player who left the game and has come back, the fact the SL could get a revamp is extremely exciting! But to answer this question my account had been deleted but I was able to sign up again and verify my account in 5 minutes. Granted the link doesn't work but the code does so at least it's something also I found the verification email in my spam inbox which is probably why a lot of new managers cant find it
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So, what's up with this then ?
Any progress ?
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Anymore of this? Seems that the early momentum has been lost?
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Hi guys,
I am sorry for the very late reply.. I have hardly been on the forums over the last 2 seasons.
If I am honest, I haven't done any work on SL since beginning of March. Lots of other work related projects that I am currently dealing that are more important to focus on than SL. I am sorry if that sounds harsh but that's the reality of it.
I am also finding it difficult to do everything myself. Yes I do have a team full of developers and programmers but they are not willing to help much especially after me telling them that we must keep the game similar to how it is currently. They wanted to do all sort of changes without understanding the concept of the game. Would have been like a football manager game so I had to pull the plug on them. I have started designing the new website layout and have made a few pages but that is all I have done.
If i find a new bunch of developers, this is going to cost me a lot of money and one has to think if his investment will come out good in the long run. There's a difference between investing in bitcoin and investing in SL.
Ideally, I would like to make a team that comprises of fellow SL managers in which I think I did mention in previous posts but nothing concrete was ever made.
When I do have the time to focus on SL, I will do so but at the moment its looking quite slim as I have other commitments I must focus on first. Moreover, seeing the decline of the game going at a slow but steady rate and with the lack of communication with the current SL board, one starts to think there could be no hope no matter what is done.
I hope everyone understands the situation and I apologise for any inconveniences.
Thanks and regards
P.S, if any members from the community are interested to join up with me, please do give me a message.
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I'll help you.
I've stated on numerous occasions in the past that I would gladly replatform this shitshow if there was an interest from CatGames/Junior.
Do you have access to the source code and artifacts ?
Can we rehost this on another platform ?
At the very least I can offer a more stable and more closely monitored environment for the app.
I can't offer anything on the marketing side which also needs a boost however.
Rgds
Globus
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Great Stuff Globus,
Kush, you have help offered now,
Regards
Deca
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I'll help you.
I've stated on numerous occasions in the past that I would gladly replatform this shitshow if there was an interest from CatGames/Junior.
Do you have access to the source code and artifacts ?
Can we rehost this on another platform ?
At the very least I can offer a more stable and more closely monitored environment for the app.
I can't offer anything on the marketing side which also needs a boost however.
Rgds
Globus
Hi Globus,
That is great thank you and I do remember you always wanting to get involved.
I do not have access to anything at all and we are all on the same level. When I had a meeting with Junior we just talked about improvement and how I could get involved and do this.
I will give you a private message in game to speak further details.
Thanks.
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Hi Kush
I've replied in game.
Cheers
Globus
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What you all need to realise is Junior is taking the piss out of you.
He's creaming a few quid every month without any intention of ever improving the game.
This is my last season, I won't be mugged off anymore.
Globus.
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What you all need to realise is Junior is taking the piss out of you.
He's creaming a few quid every month without any intention of ever improving the game.
This is my last season, I won't be mugged off anymore.
Globus.
Exactly my thoughts too. SL2 has been offline now for a month and despite sending numerous messages via Facebook text and email, junior has not replied at all. He's obviously seen my correspondence because the game has been put into maintenance mode with a picture of the site hamster. To say I've given up trying to get a response is an understatement. I feel he's not even interested in his customers and hasn't been for years now.
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What you all need to realise is Junior is taking the piss out of you.
He's creaming a few quid every month without any intention of ever improving the game.
This is my last season, I won't be mugged off anymore.
Globus.
Exactly my thoughts too. SL2 has been offline now for a month and despite sending numerous messages via Facebook text and email, junior has not replied at all. He's obviously seen my correspondence because the game has been put into maintenance mode with a picture of the site hamster. To say I've given up trying to get a response is an understatement. I feel he's not even interested in his customers and hasn't been for years now.
As long as there are some of us who still pay for credits and memberships Junior will still get some sort of income from this, like globus said, and nothing is going to be done about it.
If we all as a community say enough is enough and not spend any more money on the website until some changes are made, then and only then there might be some progress and the talks with Kush might actually lead somewhere.
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Everything is a shambles. I have stopped doing what I was doing because what is the point?
The game needs time, teamwork and funding. When one can't even get into contact with the owner.... That tells you everything.
Even if one did, you have to really think to yourself is it worth it working with someone who doesn't engage and have any care for their customers?
Junior is clearly happy making a little profit or whatever here and there as Globus stated in his above message.
It's only a matter of time that the game will stop working and in my opinion I reckon Junior would be delighted if the game was to break down as that would be the final excuse.
I didn't even know that SL2 has been down for the last month before readying Ty's post. I am sure the fix is a hard one hence Junior not bothering to do it probably due to the low income being generated from SL2. SL1 is the main one and Junior will only fix minor issues that are needed for the game to continue playing on. As an example, league season progress in the history page; this requires a bit or work with data manipulation and tables/queries being transferred from one place to another etc yet won't be fixed as it is not affecting the main structure of the game. Once something big comes knocking around the corner which could be anytime that does affect... it will truly be game over!
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I think you are right Kush. I wouldn't mind if Junior replied and replied honestly. It's the fact that any kind of communication seems to be ignored. When he does reply it makes you feel like he is actually interested and then something else happens and you just get silence. Very frustrating because we all love this site and investment in time would go a long way.
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Kush has done a sterling job in even getting the guy to engage, albeit temporarily.
Myself and Kush have exchanged various messages on how to improve the app and platform. Without the buy in from Junior its a no go.
I reckon this chap probably earns around 100 quid a month out of the current setup and has zero interest in moving that on.
Despite Kush's earnest attempts to move this project on and I have made countless attempts myself, we get nothing back at all.
Kush has done sterling work but the game has gone.
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I reckon this chap probably earns around 100 quid a month out of the current setup and has zero interest in moving that on.
I agree, that's roughly what I would expect Junior to get from SL, but he's hardly getting rich from SL. It's a very small amount of money even for a part time project. Maybe that's the problem.
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I reckon this chap probably earns around 100 quid a month out of the current setup and has zero interest in moving that on.
I agree, that's roughly what I would expect Junior to get from SL, but he's hardly getting rich from SL. It's a very small amount of money even for a part time project. Maybe that's the problem.
Has he been offered a lump sump? The new owners could recoup from increased interest (and spending) in a SL with increased interest (and spending)? Just wondering.
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Junior has no intention in selling 100% of his stake to anyone. This I know for sure. He only mentioned he is willing to do some sort of collaboration.
Moreover, if he was to sell all his stake, I am sure Junior would ask for a massive sum. He paid £40,000+ to cover the debt after Terry's passing which not only saved the game but saved Terry's family from any future financial problems. This is why he has total control 100% as Terry's family gave over their stake to Junior after he covered the debt.
There is no way in hell someone would pay 40K+ plus to control this game. I wouldn't.
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I have no idea why you guys seem able to play this game now because having just returned from a 30 day holiday, my BFF/babysitter informed me a week or so ago that she could no longer log in to the game to set up for me so I just tried about half hour ago and getting all kinds of error messages trying to get in from sundayleague.com so what's wrong I've no idea. I could try requesting a new password but the one I'm sure it is is in my saved passwords within Chrome so should be fine so why I'm having problems and you lot don't seem to be is beyond me. I guess I'll keep trying and see what happens.
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I have no idea why you guys seem able to play this game now because having just returned from a 30 day holiday, my BFF/babysitter informed me a week or so ago that she could no longer log in to the game to set up for me so I just tried about half hour ago and getting all kinds of error messages trying to get in from sundayleague.com so what's wrong I've no idea. I could try requesting a new password but the one I'm sure it is is in my saved passwords within Chrome so should be fine so why I'm having problems and you lot don't seem to be is beyond me. I guess I'll keep trying and see what happens.
Hey Nick, on the chat when you click on anyones name it takes you to their team page, when i click on yours it says :
'mancunian_nick' not in game. Has s/he resigned?
FYI
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Junior has no intention in selling 100% of his stake to anyone. This I know for sure. He only mentioned he is willing to do some sort of collaboration.
Moreover, if he was to sell all his stake, I am sure Junior would ask for a massive sum. He paid £40,000+ to cover the debt after Terry's passing which not only saved the game but saved Terry's family from any future financial problems. This is why he has total control 100% as Terry's family gave over their stake to Junior after he covered the debt.
There is no way in hell someone would pay 40K+ plus to control this game. I wouldn't.
Well now I am no longer wondering. Thanks for that :)
PS I'm beginning to think that whatever Rich does with his Imps (or whatever SL alchemy he employs) his secrets are not identifyable (and I, like, I'm sure, many others, have tried) and he is just not beatable (apart from the odd token victory in single games) and that, for me, makes it rather like the SPL has been in recent years, all a bit pointless. Add in the irritating/annoying vaguaries of the game now and its general falling-apartness (with seemingly little hope of improvement) and I can't see me spending on the game anymore which will lead to a choice of, once my credits have gone, waiting for the painful day when the little computer pops up next to the Angels or just pulling the plug and getting it over with quickly. And considering SL was how I met my husband, that will be tough--- but I can feel it approaching :-\
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Junior has no intention in selling 100% of his stake to anyone. This I know for sure. He only mentioned he is willing to do some sort of collaboration.
Moreover, if he was to sell all his stake, I am sure Junior would ask for a massive sum. He paid £40,000+ to cover the debt after Terry's passing which not only saved the game but saved Terry's family from any future financial problems. This is why he has total control 100% as Terry's family gave over their stake to Junior after he covered the debt.
There is no way in hell someone would pay 40K+ plus to control this game. I wouldn't.
Well now I am no longer wondering. Thanks for that :)
PS I'm beginning to think that whatever Rich does with his Imps (or whatever SL alchemy he employs) his secrets are not identifyable (and I, like, I'm sure, many others, have tried) and he is just not beatable (apart from the odd token victory in single games) and that, for me, makes it rather like the SPL has been in recent years, all a bit pointless. Add in the irritating/annoying vaguaries of the game now and its general falling-apartness (with seemingly little hope of improvement) and I can't see me spending on the game anymore which will lead to a choice of, once my credits have gone, waiting for the painful day when the little computer pops up next to the Angels or just pulling the plug and getting it over with quickly. And considering SL was how I met my husband, that will be tough--- but I can feel it approaching :-\
And there's an irony (or the fates playing a joke) --- Imp's first defeat for over 60 matches. It probably confirms my thoughts rather than disproving them because he'll quite likely go another 60 before his next defeat.
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I have no idea why you guys seem able to play this game now because having just returned from a 30 day holiday, my BFF/babysitter informed me a week or so ago that she could no longer log in to the game to set up for me so I just tried about half hour ago and getting all kinds of error messages trying to get in from sundayleague.com so what's wrong I've no idea. I could try requesting a new password but the one I'm sure it is is in my saved passwords within Chrome so should be fine so why I'm having problems and you lot don't seem to be is beyond me. I guess I'll keep trying and see what happens.
Hey Nick, on the chat when you click on anyones name it takes you to their team page, when i click on yours it says :
'mancunian_nick' not in game. Has s/he resigned?
FYI
Thank you for that info. Just spoken to my babysitter who tells me for a week to 10 days they were able to log in then suddenly had problems. Kept getting error message trying to log in ... same ones I'm now getting but they didn't want to make it worse. If I try to get in from Sundayleague.com it says You specified your username or password incorrectly. Clicking back says Not Found
The requested URL /login.php was not found on this server. Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. Clicking lost password says This page isn’t working sundayleague.com is currently unable to handle this request. HTTP ERROR 500.
So it looks to me like the password file has totally corrupted and it can't find me for some reason ... went on my hols around 9th May so would have happened 7 to 10 days after that but unless anyone reading this can help me get back in before my team is deleted for not being used in which case I shall totally give up and leave, that looks like it's the end for me sadly after all this time. Nothing I can do. :(
Anyone got any bright ideas or can get hold of Junior please? Needs fixing the password file I'd suggest??
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Junior has no intention in selling 100% of his stake to anyone. This I know for sure. He only mentioned he is willing to do some sort of collaboration.
Moreover, if he was to sell all his stake, I am sure Junior would ask for a massive sum. He paid £40,000+ to cover the debt after Terry's passing which not only saved the game but saved Terry's family from any future financial problems. This is why he has total control 100% as Terry's family gave over their stake to Junior after he covered the debt.
There is no way in hell someone would pay 40K+ plus to control this game. I wouldn't.
Well now I am no longer wondering. Thanks for that :)
PS I'm beginning to think that whatever Rich does with his Imps (or whatever SL alchemy he employs) his secrets are not identifyable (and I, like, I'm sure, many others, have tried) and he is just not beatable (apart from the odd token victory in single games) and that, for me, makes it rather like the SPL has been in recent years, all a bit pointless. Add in the irritating/annoying vaguaries of the game now and its general falling-apartness (with seemingly little hope of improvement) and I can't see me spending on the game anymore which will lead to a choice of, once my credits have gone, waiting for the painful day when the little computer pops up next to the Angels or just pulling the plug and getting it over with quickly. And considering SL was how I met my husband, that will be tough--- but I can feel it approaching :-\
And there's an irony (or the fates playing a joke) --- Imp's first defeat for over 60 matches. It probably confirms my thoughts rather than disproving them because he'll quite likely go another 60 before his next defeat.
i did the double last season in FL1.. had to have tactics my way all game but that’s fair since his team is so strong
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Junior has no intention in selling 100% of his stake to anyone. This I know for sure. He only mentioned he is willing to do some sort of collaboration.
Moreover, if he was to sell all his stake, I am sure Junior would ask for a massive sum. He paid £40,000+ to cover the debt after Terry's passing which not only saved the game but saved Terry's family from any future financial problems. This is why he has total control 100% as Terry's family gave over their stake to Junior after he covered the debt.
There is no way in hell someone would pay 40K+ plus to control this game. I wouldn't.
Well now I am no longer wondering. Thanks for that :)
PS I'm beginning to think that whatever Rich does with his Imps (or whatever SL alchemy he employs) his secrets are not identifyable (and I, like, I'm sure, many others, have tried) and he is just not beatable (apart from the odd token victory in single games) and that, for me, makes it rather like the SPL has been in recent years, all a bit pointless. Add in the irritating/annoying vaguaries of the game now and its general falling-apartness (with seemingly little hope of improvement) and I can't see me spending on the game anymore which will lead to a choice of, once my credits have gone, waiting for the painful day when the little computer pops up next to the Angels or just pulling the plug and getting it over with quickly. And considering SL was how I met my husband, that will be tough--- but I can feel it approaching :-\
And there's an irony (or the fates playing a joke) --- Imp's first defeat for over 60 matches. It probably confirms my thoughts rather than disproving them because he'll quite likely go another 60 before his next defeat.
i did the double last season in FL1.. had to have tactics my way all game but that’s fair since his team is so strong
and now i’ve tempted fate and will get tonked. my second tram drew him in the elite cup 🤣
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In my opinion and many other managers would vouch the same, Rich is the best manager on SL.
He knows everything from A-Z and I'm sure with all his experience, has identified what tactics are favourable to use due to certain conditions such as the referee. As an example I know of a referee that clearly gives advantages when playing continental in which he favours that style of play.... Maybe some others managers have found out the same, maybe some haven't. Knowing these sort of 'advantage' strategies will always help and I am more than sure Rich knows every trick in the book.
There is a reason to why he is one of the most decorated managers in the game and I am sure Rich has many different strategies that keeps him among the very best in terms of team strength at all times season after season.
Hats of you Rich, top quality manager.... I was hoping your new 60 game win streak wouldn't have started on me yesterday in the EC :(
Perhaps one day you could teach us what flaws you have learnt ...... How about an hourly rate of 2,500 credits? 8)
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I have no idea why you guys seem able to play this game now because having just returned from a 30 day holiday, my BFF/babysitter informed me a week or so ago that she could no longer log in to the game to set up for me so I just tried about half hour ago and getting all kinds of error messages trying to get in from sundayleague.com so what's wrong I've no idea. I could try requesting a new password but the one I'm sure it is is in my saved passwords within Chrome so should be fine so why I'm having problems and you lot don't seem to be is beyond me. I guess I'll keep trying and see what happens.
Hey Nick, on the chat when you click on anyones name it takes you to their team page, when i click on yours it says :
'mancunian_nick' not in game. Has s/he resigned?
FYI
Thank you for that info. Just spoken to my babysitter who tells me for a week to 10 days they were able to log in then suddenly had problems. Kept getting error message trying to log in ... same ones I'm now getting but they didn't want to make it worse. If I try to get in from Sundayleague.com it says You specified your username or password incorrectly. Clicking back says Not Found
The requested URL /login.php was not found on this server. Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. Clicking lost password says This page isn’t working sundayleague.com is currently unable to handle this request. HTTP ERROR 500.
So it looks to me like the password file has totally corrupted and it can't find me for some reason ... went on my hols around 9th May so would have happened 7 to 10 days after that but unless anyone reading this can help me get back in before my team is deleted for not being used in which case I shall totally give up and leave, that looks like it's the end for me sadly after all this time. Nothing I can do. :(
Anyone got any bright ideas or can get hold of Junior please? Needs fixing the password file I'd suggest??
I had a problem today with my password not being recognised. It's happened before on a couple of other websites and usually (it might take a couple of go's at trying the refused password) a box comes up with "saved log-ins/passwords" and that will work). Try it and see?
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I have no idea why you guys seem able to play this game now because having just returned from a 30 day holiday, my BFF/babysitter informed me a week or so ago that she could no longer log in to the game to set up for me so I just tried about half hour ago and getting all kinds of error messages trying to get in from sundayleague.com so what's wrong I've no idea. I could try requesting a new password but the one I'm sure it is is in my saved passwords within Chrome so should be fine so why I'm having problems and you lot don't seem to be is beyond me. I guess I'll keep trying and see what happens.
Hey Nick, on the chat when you click on anyones name it takes you to their team page, when i click on yours it says :
'mancunian_nick' not in game. Has s/he resigned?
FYI
Thank you for that info. Just spoken to my babysitter who tells me for a week to 10 days they were able to log in then suddenly had problems. Kept getting error message trying to log in ... same ones I'm now getting but they didn't want to make it worse. If I try to get in from Sundayleague.com it says You specified your username or password incorrectly. Clicking back says Not Found
The requested URL /login.php was not found on this server. Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. Clicking lost password says This page isn’t working sundayleague.com is currently unable to handle this request. HTTP ERROR 500.
So it looks to me like the password file has totally corrupted and it can't find me for some reason ... went on my hols around 9th May so would have happened 7 to 10 days after that but unless anyone reading this can help me get back in before my team is deleted for not being used in which case I shall totally give up and leave, that looks like it's the end for me sadly after all this time. Nothing I can do. :(
Anyone got any bright ideas or can get hold of Junior please? Needs fixing the password file I'd suggest??
I had a problem today with my password not being recognised. It's happened before on a couple of other websites and usually (it might take a couple of go's at trying the refused password) a box comes up with "saved log-ins/passwords" and that will work). Try it and see?
Nick, there is no way you will be able to log in. Your team has become a computer meaning your username has been deleted.
The only way to chase this would be to give a message to Junior, explaining what has happened and how this is not fair on your side. It's ridiculous to see a long serving SL manager like yourself losing their team for no reason at all. It really is a shambles and Junior should fix and clarify this immediately. If this happened to you, it could happen to any one of us.
There is no difference whether I send a message to Junior of you do. Junior will either reply or not and me sending any messages will not speed this process up.
I wish you the best of luck and I really hope Junior gives your team back.
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My log-in just failed (fine this morning) but I was offered the "secret question" option which I answered and used my old password as the new one and it was accepted. Which means my old password must have ceased to exist. Worrying.
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This whole Sundaylague thing has become a shambles through one persons laziness! Its all going to go offline soon guys.....i'd just give up bothering now.
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The game seems doomed to be honest. Last FL season, I couldnt believe that my team could finish in the top half. Seems that many aren't playing or aren't putting in the same effort anymore.
It's such a pity, this is a great game and could be a massive success with a little effort. there is nothing else out there like sundayleague
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The game seems doomed to be honest. Last FL season, I couldnt believe that my team could finish in the top half. Seems that many aren't playing or aren't putting in the same effort anymore.
It's such a pity, this is a great game and could be a massive success with a little effort. there is nothing else out there like sundayleague
Thinking back 20 years or so and the amount of servers (I started on PTV and that had 3 servers on its own) so it WAS a massive success. It'd be nice to know what started the downward slide, finances? A flaw in the game? Errors in management? It's becoming a sad monument to Terry's memory.
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I played for years on the Arsenal server and also the Esat server. The Esat server never took off, it was maybe 100 managers, a bit like Smokey is right now but the top managers from each server used to play there and experiment. The one day, there was an announcement that most servers were going to be closed. I quit and then a few years ago, I came across Sunday League again. My old username and password still worked so I started a new team.
I've really enjoyed coming back to Sunday League. In the 12 or 13 years that I was away, the game didnt change but it is still simple to play and good fun. It's a pity that it will probably all end very soon.
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Sad but true Cove ... I started on Eurostar and it's so long ago now I can't even remember the name of the server. It is a pity that it's likely to end soon ... with nobody to fix problems or support users, can't see where else it can go sadly. Oh well.
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Interesting to have another look at this thread, 2019 where has the time gone? No surprise to see the same problems, same issues and same comments.
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Very interesting indeed. Such a shame as it could have been on the cards but too much time has passed now and it's got worse... I'm not jumping the gun just because of the game freeze right now, but let's be honest this will not get any better it will only get worse. :(
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Such a shame this didn't happen.
It seems this game has just been left to die but I think if it was owned by one or a group of the active players, who were passionate about it - they could turn it into something great.
Is there any update on the situation?
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Yeah pretty clear it won't get better.
Kush has stated Junior gets around £100 a month from SL, from the start of this thread to now that's £3,400 so not a bad little earner.
Atleast that's his energy bill sorted for a month ;)
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LOL Gull
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A management buy out would be great if it was possible,
Managed by the players, run by the players, and much needed updates from the skills within the consortium of players like Kush,
Wish this could happen, we could take this game to another level
Regards
Deca
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With a bit of time and effort, the income for this game could be more like £3,400 a month. Think about just how many people used to play this game and buy credits.
Nobody I know has ever even heard of SL. (except the handful of friends who played it at school years ago, who would probably struggle to even remember it now)
An updated (reliable) website, with a bit of advertising could do wonders. But it seems the management would rather just pick up the odd £100 here and there. ::)
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totally agree with the two comments above.
He's never gonna make much more than £100pcm as it is and he clearly has no plan to grow it.
should we pool together and see if we can take it over?
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One of Kush's posts explained, not sure if it's on this thread. Junior effectively paid 40k for SL and didn't want to sell 100% of the game. Whether a 40k offer would tempt him, not sure but it would be madness anyone offering that.
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One of Kush's posts explained, not sure if it's on this thread. Junior effectively paid 40k for SL and didn't want to sell 100% of the game. Whether a 40k offer would tempt him, not sure but it would be madness anyone offering that.
He would have clawed some back by now... lol. £100 per month for the last however many years. Plenty of money has been spent on there recently, been lots of new teams coming back and rebuilding.
I kinda get him not selling it all.... maybe we should all try and meet him somewhere at a decent price. I'm in. I wouldnt do it to make money from this. Just ensure the game continues and get the attention it needs so we can all enjoy it the way it should be.
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It sounded like the £40k was to pay off Terry's (the previous owner, who actually cared about this) debts, then the family gave the game to Junior for helping them. Could be wrong.
If he expects an offer anywhere near that for the site he has run into the ground, he is living in more of a fantasy world than we thought.
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With a bit of time and effort, the income for this game could be more like £3,400 a month. Think about just how many people used to play this game and buy credits.
Nobody I know has ever even heard of SL. (except the handful of friends who played it at school years ago, who would probably struggle to even remember it now)
An updated (reliable) website, with a bit of advertising could do wonders. But it seems the management would rather just pick up the odd £100 here and there. ::)
I totally agree with this, advertising these days could work wonders, a few instagram adverts etc, also for the people who use this game everyday, I would guess around 50 users still log on everyday for definite, and if we could all get just 3 friends (which is extremely possible) to join SL, that would take it 150 users, and that’s without any social network promoting.
The game is in a league of its own compared to other management games, as you said, a little update of the site, and a new look, (but keep everything the same) could work wonders.
I wonder if there was a way we could all muck in together to keep it running, that would be great!
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Even if we can’t buy it outright would junior be open to selling a percentage, maybe sell half the rights with the idea being that the consortium buying in would be aiming to increase the revenue and he’d still be entitled to his percentage.
Also on the flip side of that having someone who knows the game inside and out plus all the other behind the scenes stuff that he knows/deals with would still be an asset
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When's this shower of shit going to start working again?
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Ah man, My days ain’t been the same lately, I miss setting up my tactics everyday ;D
If this is the end, I’m happy I managed to secure 1st place in 6-1-1 and 4th in my first season in FL1 ;D